RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SUBSAFE

["Gregory Snyder" <snyde032@umn.edu>]

I agree with Alec -
What I would find useful is a diagram of how the valves are run, how to
connect a simple circuit to run the motors, etc. The basic stuff that
will serve at least as an introduction on how to proceed with building.

Just my thoughts-
Sincerely,
Greg

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org] On Behalf Of Alec Smyth
Sent: Wednesday, June 26, 2002 8:44 AM
To: 'personal_submersibles@psubs.org'
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SUBSAFE

Pat, Ray,

Actually it seems to me your differing views can be bridged quite
easily.
The guidelines could boil down to website enhancements aimed at
answering
just 4 questions, each with its own page or section on the site. Here's
how
it might go: 

1) What type of sub do you want?
Review wet vs dry, ambient vs 1 ATM, unusual designs
Links: Sample subs of each type.

2) Do I have what it takes to build a sub? 
Review of skills, tools, sample times and costs.
Links: This could link to a nice photo-diary of a sample project. Dale
and
John's spring to mind. 

3) Do I have what it takes to develop my own design? 
Review of knowledge areas and calculations to be performed.
Links:

- For those feeling qualified, we could list standard references such as
PVHO, Busby, etc. Of course we shouldn't reinvent the wheel by
re-writing
equivalent texts, and we cannot post the existing ones online due to
copyright issues, but you can still save someone years of research just
by
presenting the calculations to be done and pointing to helpful sources. 

- For those NOT feeling qualified, refer to Kittredge or Sportsub plans.


I agree with Pat here there's no need to reinvent the wheel and provide
a
"sample design", because the Captain's existing plans are probably
ideally
suited for this.  I am not sure, however, if the Kittredge plans also
include the calculations behind them. If not so, you might one day
enhance
this section with a sample set of calculations.  I have seen some of
Kittredge's calculations and they were free-hand on notepaper, which
leads
me to believe they are probably not included with the plans.

And then finally, no matter what people think of all the preceding
questions, there is a last one if they are still with us:

4) What does it take to operate safely? 
Review of safe test and operational practices.

Links: Accident reports.

I'm thinking the above could never be interpreted as limiting anyone's
creativity, nor morph into government regulation of any sort. However,
it
would still help newcomers get a grasp when they stumble across PSUBS
but
are still thinking in terms of blowing ballast  with propane. Its really
just a fancy FAQ section on the PSUBS website.

cheers,

Alec 

-----Original Message-----
From: Ray Keefer [mailto:Ray.Keefer@Sun.COM]
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2002 8:46 PM
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SUBSAFE


Hi Pat,

> From: "Captain Nemo" <vulcania@hawaii.rr.com>
> To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SUBSAFE
> Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2002 01:24:15 -1000
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> X-Priority: 3
> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
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> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ray Keefer" <Ray.Keefer@Sun.COM>
> To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> Sent: Monday, June 24, 2002 2:16 PM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SUBSAFE
> 
> 
> >(SNIP) After they fish some what-a-be Nemo from the bottom...(SNIP)
> 
> Ray,
> 
> "What-a-be?"  Don't you mean "wannabe"?  As in, a guy who wants to be
a
> biker, but only has a Harley T-shirt?  Or a guy who wants to be a
subber,
> but never had a sub?
> 

Yes, that is what I meant.

> 
> >and find a printout from personal_submersibles@psubs.org in their
shop we
> > are going to get creamed. Maybe not through legistration but
certainly a
> > civil suite of some sort.
> 
> Good point.  I choose to avoid any such potential for liability.
Please
do
> not use any of my writings in your book.

Would you also like me to flush all references of you from PSUBS? I hate
to
say it Pat but you are all over the archives. :)

Actually I would just shut down the site. How is that
for a solution? How many PSUBers, even subbers, will ever realize their 
dream then?


> 
> Thanks for understanding.
> 
> Pat
> 
> 

Seems to me your point of view is to share informatin 
to avoid being accused of giving anyone bad information. 

On the other hand I want to give enough to prevent a death. Hmmm,
lawyers 
verses ethics.

I started PSUBS, and stuck with it, to encourage the latter point of
view.
Pat you can help or not that is your choice.

Regards,
Ray