Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST]:RE: PSUB RipOff!!

[Steven Mills <cirtemoeg@juno.com>]

Well, I'm going to step in here and hopefully won't "step-in-it" and
ruffle
any feathers.  I don't want to invalidate your grievance and displeasure
over this, paying and waiting for something that does not meet your
expectations
are understandable.

But, I think I would have discussed this with Jon "offlist" first then if
I didn't
receive satisfactory reasons/answers, then I may air my displeasure
onlist.
I only know Jon through this forum, but, from my impressions over the
2+years
since joining pSubs, I do not think he intentionally "ripped" you off.
Some of us, if not all, are avid collectors of "any" info that has the
word "sub"
in it. I know I have had my share of less than expected products, plans,
books, etc.,
[ not from pSubs ].  A few years ago I could hardly find much info on
personal
submersib;es, but I have the feeling with forums like pSubs and others
that
have popularized and generated interest in subs, I'm seeing more and more
documentation and books on the subject.

I've seen the offer for the K250 plan. I am planning on ordering it, but
my expectations
of it didn't fit the criteria that you expected.  I didn't think it was
something I could
build something on except whet my imagination and give me visual ideas.
But....that's
me. Also, having been on pSubs for a while, I know there are people here
who
have built the K250 and I know I can rely on their advice and counsel
regarding
parts, pitfalls, what to do...not do, etc., while having the k250 pic in
front of me and
adding copious notes from what I learn on the forum.

Well, I hope I haven't fuelled your anger any more than it is. That was
not my intent.
However, don't judge Jon or the forum by this.

Thanks, --Steve
  



On Mon, 23 Feb 2004 18:48:14 -0800 (PST) david cutajar
<davecutajar@djcengineering.com> writes:
> Yup, that's right- PSUB Ripoff!! Who would have
> thought that??Maybe if I purchased from Ebay, but from
> PSUB?????
> 
> I recently purchased the K250 pressure hull plan from
> the online store on the Psub.org website.
> 
> This one page plan is touted as:
> 
>  " an excellent resource as a starting point for those
> who want to construct their own submersible. ".
> 
> I Paid by PayPal - Payment  To  Jonathan Wallace on
> Jan. 24, 2004;
> 
> I received the package today Feb. 23, 2004.
> 
> I purchased the plan, thinking it would be a good
> reference source (as they claimed).
> 
> As you may suspect, I am very disapointed in the
> print. It is terrible, and offers NO value. 
> 
> The BOM (Bill Of Material) only references Part
> numbers - i.e. there is no information on anything
> that is of value: for example if you were curious as
> to what size rings (hull frame)were used - or the
> rings thickness etc., all you will realize is that it
> is detail #3 part number K250-007 - Completely
> Useless.
> 
> Curious about the diameter of the forward viewport?
> too bad - all it says is part number K250-020.
> 
> After a much anticipated wait of one month I cannot
> believe how bad I got ripped off, and the worst part
> is I waited a month.
> 
> Obtaining this Item from PSUB made me feel secure in
> my purchase. The description in PSUB is not accurate.
> 
> This item is BENEATH this fine web site and I implore
> you to REMOVE this item from the online store as it is
> a complete rip-off.
> 
> I am the owner of an engineering firm (just north of
> Detoit, MI). We design and manufacture industrial
> equipment from clean room enviroments to foundry
> equipment. We often get jobs that are too complex or
> technical for other companies and we have designed
> laser welders,camera & optics, specialty machines for
> fuel cell processes, robotic cells of all sorts,
> secondary plastics equipment, entire plant lines, Mig,
> tig, laser cells, non- destruct inspection equip,
> material handling etc., etc., etc. We do small tools
> such as operator assisted tools for assembly plants,
> to complete manufacturing lines & engineering ($110M).
> Many of these industries require a large amount of
> R&D. 
> 
> I have been doing alot of R&D, for the design I am
> working on for (2) one person subs, that I plan to
> build and certify together. The subs can be operated
> in a "connected" mode, or detached, operating both
> together in a "buddy-system" fashion, like SCUBA for
> safety.
> 
> I started out as a machinist in High School, where I
> took 1st in the state every year; I was a project
> leader (for a company)when I was still in High School;
> I became a fixture builder, then Model Maker (that
> industry went out), CNC operator, CAD operator,
> designer, Special Machines & Gages, BIW process and
> tooling.
> 
> I don't do the hands on as much anymore - I havn't
> been on Catia or UG for years, but I can find my way
> around Mech-Desktop though.
> 
> I'm not bragging or preaching to this group - I know
> there is a ton of knowledge and talent in this group.
> I just wanted to let you know that I am not a complete
> idiot, and that I have been around a shop, wrenches,
> torches and prints for my entire life, and that this
> print sucked (hard).
> 
> If anyone wants a copy, I will scan it (into several
> (4?) sections) and give them to you free; but please
> do not purchase this as you will be disapointed.
> 
> Sorry for the negative email.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> David Cutajar
> DJC Engineering
> 
> davecutajar@yahoo.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 


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