Re: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] H2O2 combustion chamber

["Herve" <caribsub@coqui.net>]

look for the kursk for instance.
There was  a leak of H2O2 inside a torpedo, the pressure built up and blew
up the engine compartment of the torpedo, then the chemical reaction turned
into fire that in turn blew up the warhead of the torpedo and the entire
compartment.
There is a complete story by the way at discovery channel about the kursk.
same thing happened to 2 US subs.
Very often Navies do not want to recognize the real cause of the destruction
of their sub because some time it is really stupid.
The scorpion for instance, in Europe it is said to sailors that the trash
dump valve stayed opened after a wrong manoeuver, another  mistake in the
design placed that valve right above the battery compartment, the rest is
easy to imagine, major leak, sea water on battery and battery connections.
of course it is always more attractive to blaim it on an attack by another
sub and other james bond stuff, the reality is often really basic.
Back in the service we used to blow bombs made of 2 liquids, which once
mixed together turn into an explosive solution with a high detonation once
triggered. 1 of the 2 liquids is H2O2, pure, of course not the one you buy
at the department store. I will not reveal the second liquid that one can
find almost anywhere, beleive me I dont want H2O2 in my sub
As you can see theses stories are not used to be found easily on the net
Herve


----- Original Message -----
From: <rjune@fuse.net>
To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 5:35 PM
Subject: Re: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] H2O2 combustion chamber


> Herve,
>
> You mention that,
> "peroxyde was a direct cause of multiple deaths in subs"
> I did a quick web serch for this subject and found nothing.
> Can you point me to some accident reports / news reports about
> h2o2 related stories.
>
> p.s. I'm not implying that there are not any accidents
>      just that i couldn't find any info about them.
>
> Roger
> >
> > From: "Herve" <caribsub@coqui.net>
> > Date: 2002/07/15 Mon PM 03:46:06 EDT
> > To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] H2O2 combustion chamber
> >
> > Pete, sorry , i did not mean to insult you, but to me peroxyde is rocket
> > making, not subs you are dealing basically with an explosive and a very
> > corrosive material.
> > peroxyde was a direct cause of multiple deaths in subs.
> > so i dont understand why the trouble when the futur in mini subs is
> > somewhere else.
> > murphy' law : if something bad can happen it will!!
> > Right now the most advanced studies by navies in mini subs propulsion
are on
> > how to produce  or store O2  in large amount in a mini sub so it can
feed
> > fuel cells.
> > it is safe, very powerfull , expensive though but probalbly the next
step in
> > mini subs not powered by a nuclear reactor.
> > peroxyde should be limited to unmanned vehicles like torpedoes which
have
> > severe power choice requirements anyways
> > Herve
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Pete suds" <subs_n_suds@hotmail.com>
> > To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> > Sent: Monday, July 15, 2002 1:25 PM
> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] H2O2 combustion chamber
> >
> >
> > > Thanks for the support guys. Just a few things:
> > > I am not inventing a new concept, this technology actually goes back
to
> > the
> > > early 1940s, and has been used by NASA and amateurs since then. The
list
> > is
> > > too numerous to include here.
> > >
> > > Of all the reaction chambers using the DeLaval nozzle, this is by far
the
> > > safest. Believe me, I have been researching new propulsion devices for
> > many
> > > years and this is one of the better concepts.
> > > There is far too much information to include in a message. I will
develop
> > a
> > > white paper to include calcs, stoichiometry, theory, flow diagrams,
etc.
> > > I will provide pictures of my nozzle.
> > >
> > > Lessons learned based on other failures will be incorporated in the
> > design.
> > >
> > > I built an underwater DPV (20 years ago), and have designed many
devises,
> > > both professionally and personally. I always over design for safety. I
> > > always test designs when high pressures or temperatures are involved.
> > >
> > > I welcome comments, both good and bad. If you feel something is
unsafe,
> > > PLEASE let me know, just don't insult me. Thanks again for the input.
> > > Suds
> > >
> > >
> > > >From: "Eliezer Rodriguez" <eliezer_rodriguez@hotmail.com>
> > > >Reply-To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> > > >To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> > > >Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] H2O2 combustion chamber
> > > >Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 13:20:33 +0000
> > > >
> > > >Hey guys,
> > > >
> > > >I wonder where what would happen if Benjamin Franklin didn't made his
> > kite
> > > >and key experiment on a thunderstorm because it sounded dangerous.
True,
> > > >you could easily get killed but, remmember that if he wouldn't
> > electricity
> > > >wouldn't be around and neither batteries nor subs.
> > > >
> > > >Obviously nobody wants to get killed, but if stop trying new ways to
do
> > > >things because of fear then your life will be boring as hell.
Research
> > and
> > > >then test your ideas with caution maybe you will be in history books
in a
> > > >couple decades, who knows.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >Eliezer Rodriguez
> > > >"The only thing in life to fear is fear itself."
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >_________________________________________________________________
> > > >Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
> Roger June
> REJ and Company
> rjune@fuse.net
> 513-300-1189
>
>
>