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[PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure compensation



Wade,
     I know this is an off-topic post, but I feel that all that read your 
comments should also read this.
     I in no way attempted to be negative about you using an oil, even fish 
oil in your gearbox.  I think the idea is a good and highly inovative one 
especially if you have to have a bio-degradable form of oil.  I thought it 
was creative.  I just could not resist the joking comment about the smell 
which you brought up to start with.  You took the joke at first as I 
intended it, without seeing it as casting a dispersion.  I have no idea 
what you read looking back in the thread that made you think I was 
attacking your idea.
     If I offended, I sincerely apologize, cause I had no intent.  It was 
simply the kind of joke my colleagues at school would exchange freely and 
laugh at the pun.  Maybe it's a Southern thing but we joke like that all 
the time down here with no underlying meaning or negativity.
     Once again I hope you will accept what I am saying.  I have never seen 
a "dumb" idea from any of your posts.

Gary Boucher




>Gary,
>I just read the Unconventional UW thread backwards.  Although it was
>extremely entertaining, I suddenly understand your concern about making fun
>of my fish oil.  However, I am the first to admit that I have many many very
>stupid ideas and only the occasional good one.  But as long as I keep having
>the occasional good one I will continue to blurt out the dumb ones.  Which
>then means I need a clever fellow like your self to tell me that it is a
>dumb idea so I don't have to suffer through finding that out myself.  So I
>beg of you, next time just come right out and say it, it will save me time
>and effort in the long run (even if I don't find it very funny at first).
>Where I live, we now have three brand new and thoroughly useless, but very
>expensive ferries.  They were built because nobody really bothered to stand
>up and say exactly what they thought of the whole idea.  And by the way, you
>can never squash creative thinking, no matter how bad the joke.
>Actually, the whole reason I'm writing this is that now I'm imagining that
>you could have come up with a really good joke and I'm missing it.
>Cheers,
>
>Wade
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org]On Behalf Of Gary R.
>Boucher
>Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2000 8:44 AM
>To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure compensation
>
>
>Wade,
>      I was going to joke with you and tell you that I thought your idea to
>use fish oil stunk.  But, I would get more negative mail saying that I
>squashed creative thinking.  I like your idea, I just don't know if I could
>go with the fish oil.  Does it really smell like fish?  I think for those
>not entering contests they might try submersible pump oil.  Was this for
>man powered wet subs?  I can see where they would not want to recreate the
>Exxon Valdez (Sp?) scenario on a smaller scale.
>
>GB
>
>
> >Gary,
> >I've actually compensated a drive train in this way before.  Granted it
> >wasn't a trolling motor but it did work in my application.  I used a high
> >viscosity oil made from fish (so it was biodegradable which fit with the
> >rules of the competition I was in).  It smelled terrible, but it was cheap
> >and worked really well.  Unfortunately, it was discovered that you still
> >need do put on some sort of compensation device (we used a sturdy balloon)
> >because it is very difficult to get all of the air out of the system and
> >even the tiny bubbles will contract and suck some water through the seal if
> >you don't. However, the balloon only needs to be very small.  It actually
> >improved the efficiency of our drive train because it lubricated all the
> >parts (there were lots of gears and no long shafts).  Anyways, the point is
> >if the losses aren't too significant it is a very simple and very cheap way
> >of fixing the problem.
> >
> >Wade
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> >[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org]On Behalf Of Gary R.
> >Boucher
> >Sent: Friday, August 11, 2000 11:23 PM
> >To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> >Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure compensation
> >
> >
> >Jon,
> >      You're right in that the mentioned method is a much better way of
> >compensating.  I wonder if anyone has ever been successful at using a low
> >viscosity oil in a trolling motor.  It would be an interesting experiment
> >in the direction of a low cost compensated thruster.  It almost makes me
> >want to go get a trolling motor and experiment.  I wonder if the armature
> >would have too much drag against the oil and how much power you would loose
> >in the process.  I would think that cooling would not be a big problem.  I
> >would suspect that real thrusters for submersibles that are compensated in
> >this way have special armatures.  Probably the same oil used in submersible
> >pump applications would work.
> >
> >GB
> >
> >At 08:16 PM 8/11/00 , you wrote:
> > >On Fri, 11 Aug 2000 22:00:37 -0700, "Gary R. Boucher" <protek@shreve.net>
> > >wrote:
> > >
> > > >      The trick is having the pressure inside the motor the same as the
> > > > outside pressure, or at least close.  If you set the pressure inside
>the
> > > > motor at a certain value and ascended the pressure inside is greater
> >than
> > > > outside.  If you dove beyond the set pressure you have more pressure
> > > > outside.  One method of pressure compensating a motor is to place a
> >rubber
> > > > bladder with air in the water close to the motor and run a tube from
>the
> > > > bladder to the motor housing.  As the sub dives the pressure on the
> > > bladder
> > > > increases and so does the inside motor pressure.
> > >
> > >Just as a point of interest...
> > >
> > >In deep professional-quality thrusters, they typically fill the thruster
> > >housing (and thus the motor) with oil, which makes the whole deal
>basically
> > >non-compressable. Instead of using a seal, they use a magnetic coupling
>to
> > >turn the propeller. This gives a thruster that can be used to full ocean
> > >depths.
> > >
> > >Later,
> > >Jon
> > >
> > >--------------------------------------------------------------
> > >    Jon Hylands      Jon@huv.com      http://www.huv.com/jon
> > >
> > >   Project: Micro Seeker (Micro Autonomous Underwater Vehicle)
> > >            http://www.huv.com