Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PSUB Fatalities...

["Vikking" <vikking@mindspring.com>]

hello, the only thing i can thinkof when comparing what is like tryng to get
out of a small vessel that is being floded is a litle fish that somebody put
on the toilet bowl to clean the aquarium, and by mistaque somebody flushed!!

lets run a simulation to help whith the safety issue, and by the way i think
that driving on I95 down to Miami is more dangerous, than a psub.

the pilot will not be able to get out till the vessel is completely floded,
he will need to push against a lot of pressure to get out, how does your
vessel behaves when flooded? hey no need to try rigth now... this is only a
simulation...
may be you will be upside down , stern down , sideways?, meanwhile the
partially floded vessel is descending , there is not shallow water, only
deep shit...
 the pilot has manage to breath from the scuba inside the psub, so he still
alive, but deep, what is the descent rate of the vessel when floded, ?

the only way the pilot can earn some time is by decreasing the rate of
descent, which also decreases the force at which the water comes in , but ,
i can tell you it comes pretty fastmy point is that scuba will save  the
pilot some time, but it will not insure is safety, it needs to be use added
in addition of  a way to stop the vessel to sink below critical deph, for
the diver 50 meters) and become positive buoyant, hey we are not planning to
leave our toys  rusting on the bottom are we?

Gabriel Feldman
---- Original Message -----
From: Captain Nemo <vulcania@interpac.net>
To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2000 6:51 AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PSUB Fatalities...


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <VBra676539@aol.com>
> To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2000 3:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PSUB Fatalities...
>
>
> > As an addendum to what I said the other day to Pat about blow and go
> ascents and Navy type escape gear, it seemed that I missed a point. Pat's
> sub and Jon's and some others are limited depth vehicles. I forgot that
any
> accident (well, nearly any) that might require flooding of these hulls
would
> occur in shallow water ... relatively speaking. Shallow enough to fall
into
> the sport/air diving categories which would certainly allow egress in a
> SCUBA rig, and might even allow time to deploy buoys or lift lines or
> something. So for the smaller shallower guys, SCUBA seems like a good
> option.
>
>
> Right on.  I stay shallow, but ya never know; she could, say, bust a
window.
> Then, my immediate concern will be how to avoid drowning before I can get
> out or my dive crew can get to me; that's where the SCUBA comes in.
>
> VIKKING makes a good point about getting hung up on exit: my hatch is
REALLY
> small (an unavoidable consequence of fitting a working sub inside a scale
> fictional design).  I wouldn't be able to get out wearing the rig.  But
I'm
> pretty relaxed underwater, and I'm betting I can keep my cool long enough
to
> stay alive while she bottoms out, open the hatch, exit, and pull the tank
> out behind me.  At that point, (unless I'm hurt) I don't see myself
> immediately breaking for the surface, but rather, working with the dive
crew
> to get a plan going as to how we're going to salvage my sub.
>
> I think there's been a lot of good safety considerations made in this
> thread.  Another one I'd like to suggest is the addition of an EXTERNAL
> FLOOD VALVE your rescuers can get to, that will enable them to equalize
> pressure inside the boat and get to you in the event you're stuck on the
> bottom, incapacitated,  and trapped inside.  I don't have one of these on
my
> boat yet, but after reading about the German accident, I'm going to
install
> one.  (That guy was only in about 100 feet of water; I'm wondering why
> divers couldn't get him out, and I'm guessing maybe they didn't have a way
> to equalize the pressure on the hatch?  Carsten / Anybody know about this
> part of the accident?)
>
> I think experimental homebuilt subs are always going to be chancy; but if
we
> strive for safety, I believe we can operate them within reasonably
> acceptable levels of calculated risk.
>
> Pat
>