[PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
Al Secor via Personal_Submersibles
personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Sun Jul 26 12:35:01 EDT 2015
Alan,
But then you would be excluding those with only a 24v system from using the max output...I assume the wide voltage input spec is to satisfy both
voltage systems.
Al Secor
--------------------------------------------
On Sun, 7/26/15, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Date: Sunday, July 26, 2015, 11:57 AM
Ken,you
are saying the LED operates from 21 to 45
volts.If we had a switch that switched between 24
& 36 volts in the hull,& an IC that
detected the difference in the light housing,then
we wouldn't need an extra wire / pin to initiate a
changefrom 5000 to 10000 lumens.cheers
Alan
Sent from my
iPad
On
27/07/2015, at 1:39 am, Ken Martindale via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote:
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#yiv3279730652 Sean, There will not be any change in
the LED intensity as long as the input voltage is between
21.6 volts and 45 volts. We will tightly regulate the
current into the LED array. Noise on the power input may not
be a problem within certain limits since the input EMI
filter will handle a fair amount of noise. If your slip rings break the power
flow the light will continue to operate for about 3 to 8
milliseconds or less. It won’t be damaged or degraded.
Might get some interesting current surges
though. Can’t make a statement about the
commercial drivers since some of them are low quality (they
still mostly work). Ken From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Sean T. Stevenson via
Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Sunday,
July 26, 2015 8:52 AM
To: Personal
Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights How sensitive are
LED drivers to supply voltage stability? If I were to, for
example, feed the LED light with 24 VDC that must first pass
through a set of electrical slip rings, would any
fluctuation in resistance or momentary interruption to the
supply harm the light?Sean On July 26, 2015 6:38:23 AM
MDT, Ken Martindale via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote:Basically that’s the same
for this light except it will shut off until it cools down,
take a look at the spec. Ken From:
Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On B! ehalf Of Alan James via
Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Saturday,
July 25, 2015 9:21 PM
To: Personal
Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Thanks for that info
Hugh.This extract from a manual below,
is for a 700lm light. So heating as you say will be a big
issue.How
hard is thermal rollback Ken???.....
General Notes and Warnings The Nano SeaLite can be run in
air, but will go into thermal rollback, where its light
output diminishes to protect the light from overheating.
This is normal and purposely designed to protect the LEDs
from being damaged by excess heat buildup while running in
air. The light will return to full brightness once it is
submerged in water or it’s allowed to cool down. This
thermal rollback will not happen when light is being
operated in water under normal usage. WARNING When the Nano
SeaLite is operated in air the body may reach temperatures
in excess of 65° C. These temperatures may be enough to
cause burns if the light is handled without protective
clothing.Alan From: Hugh Fulton via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: 'Personal Submersibles General
Discussion' <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2015 12:34
PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights 40
degrees gives you 30 degrees120
degrees! gives you 80 degreesIt
doesn’t matter whether acrylic, Glass or borosilicate with
flat planes.The
only reservation on my lights is that I have not done a lens
for the seawater to optimise angles etc. Also my reflector
is round with a square LED.Looks great in the swimming pool
at night but as I haven’t dived it I have no experience as
to how it will look in the sea.
With a really compact light and 94 watts of heat it is not
going to last long in the air. It will need serious
fins. Needs to be idiot proof.One
thing is that it needs to have automatic dimming reduction
for temperature so it does not desolder or destroy O⡍ rings etc.I
will try and work out how the forum works and go to that.
I could not get into it but could view it. Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Ken Martindale via
Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Sunday,
26 July 2015 11:58 a.m.
To:
'Personal Submersibles General Discussion'
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights PS
We are supposed to be discussing the LED light on the
forum? ken From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles
Sent:
Saturday, July 25, 2015 7:33 PM
To:
'Personal Submersibles General Discussion' <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Re-
Dimming.Would it not be better to have 2
switchable intensities rather than variable. Then you can
have a 3 position switch. Is it simpler?Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Sunday, 26 July 2015 8:20 a.m.
To: Personal Submersibles General
Discussion
Subject: Re:
[PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights Yes
we did but we had two members that were pushing hard for
dimming. From feedback, we were two for and two against.
I would prefer not have it but if it makes the lite more
generally accepted, I am willing to incorporate it. This
last version of suggestions are just that, suggestions. A
understand that nothing is frozen and we still do not have
final consensus. Cliff On
Sat, Jul 25, 2015 at 3:13 PM, Ken Martindale via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote:Cliff, Dimming, I thought we deleted
this?Ken From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Saturday! , July 25, 2015 3:29
PM
To: Personal Submersibles General
Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Ken, I took you latest pass on
spec and generated a one page summary.
Cliff On
Sat, Jul 25, 2015 at 9:48 AM, Ken Martindale via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote:This light will require
substantial cooling! . Total dissipation is about 94
watts. Puts out a lot of light.
Ken From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2015 10:18
AM
To: Personal Submersibles General
Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-M! AILIST] LED
Lights Alan, my thinking is that with the
flange, you could mount the light either way. On the new
boat I am designing, I am planning a FRP recess so that
outside of the flange is flush with the outside of the FRP
shell. Would still need to cut a hole were the body passes
through the FRP shell. Yes this does reduce the convection
heat transfer from the light but I was thinking of leaving
say a 3/8 clearance around the recessed flange. I
don't see any problem with either approach to sealing on
a MPB by using a neoprene flat
gadget. Cliff On
Fri, Jul 24, 2015 at 3:58 PM, Alan James via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote:Cliff,I
was thinking of fitting the light in to a bowl
shapedrecess in the fairing / ballast
tank, whereas you were proposingcutting a hole out & fitting
it in. In hindsight your idea is
betterbecause my idea would inhibit the
heat dispersion due to the
fiberglasssurrounding the light
fitting.Alan From: Cliff Redus via
Personal_Submersibles &! lt;personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General
Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2015 8:43
AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Alan, I am visual kind of guy.
Can send me sketch of what you are describing and we can
talk. Cliff On
Fri, Jul 24, 2015 at 3:23 PM, Alan James via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote: Looks a good solid light
Cliff.On
looking at the perpendicular cable entry, I was thinking
weneed a back entry for the purposes
of mounting in to a housingin
the fairing as you have requested in your
list.I
am looking at mounting in to ballast tanks so will create
the shape of
the light in the molding to receive it. If there was a
threadedextension on the back of the light
it could slot through a hole & be
securedwith a nut. This would make it
easier to seal off the ballast tanks
inmy
situation.Alan From: Cliff Redus via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General
Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2015 1:55
AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Ken, if you go to Youtube and do a
search on https://youtu.be/D7VnwODU7vk,
or 5000 Lumen Bridgelux Vero 18 LED light, you will see a
short video of the light. Cliff On
Thu, Jul 23, 2015 at 3:29 PM, Ken Martindale via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote: Cliff, How
do I look at them?? Ken From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Clifford Redus via
Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Thursday,
July 23, 2015 4:18 PM
To: Personal
Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Now
that Jon has the forum site set up for the LED light
project, my suggestion is to move the discussion to the
forum site called out in Jon's email. BTW, I have
uploaded to the site the wiring diagram and housing drawings
for the 5000 Lumen light that was designed by the ME
students I was mentoring last
year. Cliff On
Thu, Jul 23, 2015 at 2:55 PM, Ken Martindale via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote:Doing the dimming electrically is
easy but the problem is the extra wiring and where do you
mount the Potentiometer? We can
include the wires in the cable for use as an option this
also complicates the cabling. Instead of two wires we would
require 4 wires. Personally I also like the dimming
since it will extend the time you can use it out of the
water. Anybody also like or dislike? Cliff would like to
delete. You
guys! be sure to keep reading the spec. it will have almost
daily updates for a while. Ken From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Thursday, July 23, 2015 3:31 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General
Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Cliff,
Ken,I
like the dimming option. The 10,000 lumens may be too much
light insome low visibility conditions
where there is a lot of back
scatter.The
5,000 lumen option may act like a fog
light.Also I am thinking of having
lights mounted to the side which may
notneed to be as
intense.Depth rating.... looking at the
drawings of various 10,000 meter light
housings,it
seems simple to achieve a reasonable depth without much more
cost.Potting the board..... I would be
careful about what was potted in case some of
thecomponents needed to get rid of a
bit of heat.Mechanical housing..... ! with you
on that one Cliff. Like the idea of the recessed
light.Alan From: Clifford Redus via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Person! al Submersibles General
Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Friday, July 24, 2015 4:06
AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Ken, good first pass at the
specs. Below are comments. BTW, I will post these here
as I have not been able to get the activation code back yet
on registering at the
forum. Item 2.1 DC Voltage. If it were
me, I would stick with nominal battery bank voltages of 24
and 36 VDC. When I switch to MK 101 thrusters, I dropped
my main battery bank voltage to 36VDC my instrumentation bus
is 24VDC. Would need a single fuse holder to accept
fuses to handle different nominal
voltages. Item 4.0 Depth Requirement. In
the spirit of keeping cost down, I think 500 meters (1640
ft) would be more than enough. I know Scott is designing a
deep diving boat but is any one else shooting for more than
500m? 6.0
Dimming. I would omit the ability to dim the light.
Yes I know it is easy from an electrical point of view but
it forces us to go with more pins on the subsea connector.
I am thinking on installing multiple lighs so I could just
control on/off for each light. I could go either way on
this but in the spirit of KISS, I vote to omit
dimming. 8.3
Ports I would change plastic to acrylic. I don't
think we will end up here but if we do, we can use PVHO flat
view port calcs to size the acrylic
lens. 9.0
Printed Wiring Boards. I really like the way the Minn-Kota
motor controller PWBs are potted. Rather than using the
spray on hydrophobic coatings, to me we should pot the board
(accept for access to fuse). Therefore suggest changing
the word coated to
potted. 11.0 Mechanical Housing. I
suggest. The LED panel light and PCB shall be contained
in a single 1-atm flange mounted cylindrical housing with
a low profile that can be recessed in a FRP shell with
attachment screws from the rear of the flange. The housing
should contain a single 29 LED Array rated at 10,000
lumens with a rated power of 91-140
lumens/W (109-71W). Mounting holes will be provided for
an optional SS yoke style support bracket.
Material: Hard anodized 6061-T6 or
7071-T6 TBD (I have a grey beard machinist friend that
owns a machine shop. He loves 7071-T6 as it is a dream to
machine and stronger than
6061-T6. On
Thu, Jul 23, 2015 at 9:52 AM, Ken Martindale via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote: Cost is critical. The electronics
should be a small part of the cost. The housing might be the
most expensive. Hope you guys are reading the
specification. Ken From: Personal_Submersibles
[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org]
On Behalf Of Clifford Redus via
Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Thursday,
July 23, 2! 015 10:18 AM
To: Personal
Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED
Lights Jon, thanks for setting up the
forum. I am assuming we can post files as
well. &nb! sp;I agree low cost is
important but having a functioning light is as well. OTS
LED utility lights like that one you noted are not an option
unless they can be potted. To me the best way to keep the
cost low, is to publish construction drawings of a 1-atm
DIY housing that a psubber could machine or have machined
by a friend, and publish a design of a PCB that could be
easily fabricated using one of the PCB online sites like
ExperessPCB www.expresspcb.com and
DIY populate the board. As a group, we design and build a
prototype that I can test in my shop. If it works as
designed, then we post to the psubs site a report, that
includes the design drawings, circuit diagram, parts list
and test
results. Getting a consciences on the
design spec is the first
step. Cliff On
Wed, Jul 22, 2015 at 10:11 PM, Jon Wallace via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
wrote:
My three words of advice...cost, cost, cost.
One measure of a success for
this project will be how many people actually build/use
it. If it costs more to manufacture than just purchasing
something like http://www.surpluscenter.com/Electrical/Lights/DC-Mobile-Equipment-Lights/12-24-VDC-3120-LUMEN-16-LED-UTILITY-FLOOD-LIGHT-12-999-B.axd
off the shelf then it's real world application by
psubbers may be limited.
Over-spec'ing the design above requirements
for typical recreational operations (ie 10,000 psi
capability) is likely going to drive up the cost. Also,
let's remember that "cheap", "low
cost", and "good price" are relative terms
for a diverse group like PSUBS so include realistic
estimates of parts and manufacturing especially if tooling
is required.
Jon
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