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Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Software

To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Software
From: MerlinSub@t-online.de
Date: 22 Oct 2010 17:51 GMT
Reply-to: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Sender: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
I strongly recommend not to give automatic or semi-automatic 
spreadsheet (or guns) away to people which maybe not understand the physics behind it..
Otherwise the explain to the sheet and the sheet itself must be idiot proof.

Most spreadsheet make funny things if you give numbers in which is outside 
the borders and only people with some right technical background will notice it. 

I remember very well a automatic spreadsheet a friend a I wrote long time ago to survive a 4 hours test in the given time during our study. Was something with stress, pressure and wave impact against oilrig legs.. 

The test question has  20 or more factors, but one was surprisely zero for one complete useless small correction factor 14 students get the programm-sheet free from us, because they ask for it and get all a zero as main answer. Some realize that zero can not be the right answer, has no idea were the mistake in the complex programm was and starts to calculate by hand four long hours long. And not managed it complete in time. Some others, hopefully not working later in the maritime industry did not realize that a zero is wrong figure as answer, wrote it down and fails also. Only two guys - which have written the programm realize that is was a divison by zero error somewere in the formulars and count for the small correction factor 0,00001 in and get the right results.. 

vbr Carsten 


"irox" <irox@ix.netcom.com> schrieb:
> 
> Actually, what might be a good idea is to put together
> some templates for various aspects of design and maybe
> Jon could put them on the psubs website, also other more
> experienced folks could peer review and help improve them.
> I probably won't get a chance to do this until the weekend.
> 
> Cheers,
>   Ian.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Firebolt <spartan67@live.com>
> >Sent: Oct 21, 2010 3:54 PM
> >To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> >Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Software
> >
> >Do you think you can lend me one? I know it is cheating, I will read books 
> >in fact I am going to buy the Cambridge book about submarine design.
> >
> >Thanks
> >
> >John
> >
> >--------------------------------------------------
> >From: "irox" <irox@ix.netcom.com>
> >Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2010 5:10 PM
> >To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> >Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Software
> >
> >>
> >> I use openoffice for the ABS hull calcs and other more complex
> >> spreadsheets.  Otherwise I tend to use docs.google.com.
> >>
> >> If you are asking "what is in my spreadsheets", well, pretty much
> >> every quantifiable parameter of the submarine.  I have spreadsheets
> >> for hull designs (comparing the weights and volumes of different
> >> designs), spreadsheets for batteries specs (listing many types of
> >> batteries, cost per 1Ah, no. of batteries for $10K, weight, etc...),
> >> weights and balances spreadsheet, totaling and the weights (with
> >> there x,y,z location so moments can be calculated) and volumes so
> >> I can tell if the sub floats the right way up.
> >>
> >> A great start would be a Naval Architecture text book (I use one
> >> from the 50s) which should explain the weights and balances
> >> calcs, which is a great place to start.
> >>
> >> With spreadsheets and I quick determine if making a ballast tank
> >> larger or smaller will have the desired effect I am after, or
> >> if releasing the drop weight will it cause the vessel to be unstable
> >> when it hits the surface, what happens if an MBT suddenly
> >> floods, will the VBT keep the hatch above water?
> >>
> >> Spreadsheets using simple Newtonian physics (no drag, etc..) to
> >> get quick estimates of how quickly the sub can turn using different
> >> bow/stern thrusters.
> >>
> >> When you are reading a book and come across a bunch of formulas,
> >> stick them in a spreadsheet and see how different parameters
> >> will effect your sub.
> >>
> >> Spreadsheet can be very powerful design aids.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Ian.
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >>>From: Firebolt <spartan67@live.com>
> >>>Sent: Oct 21, 2010 2:52 PM
> >>>To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> >>>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Software
> >>>
> >>>What spreadsheets?
> >>>
> >>>john
> >>>
> >>>--------------------------------------------------
> >>>From: "irox" <irox@ix.netcom.com>
> >>>Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2010 4:46 PM
> >>>To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
> >>>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Software
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Spreadsheets are probably the main design tool I use.
> >>>> I use CAD as well, but mainly if I am calculating the
> >>>> volume of a strange shape or something.
> >>>>
> >>>> Ian.
> >>>>
> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>
> >>>> From: Firebolt
> >>>>
> >>>> Sent: Oct 21, 2010 5:25 AM
> >>>>
> >>>> To: Psusbs
> >>>>
> >>>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Software
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> What is the software that is being used to design a
> >>>> sub?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> thanks
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> john
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> ************************************************************************
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> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ************************************************************************
> >> ************************************************************************
> >> ************************************************************************
> >> The personal submersibles mailing list complies with the US Federal
> >> CAN-SPAM Act of 2003.  Your email address appears in our database
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> >> from our organization.
> >>
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> >>
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> >>
> >> PSUBS.ORG
> >> PO Box 53
> >> Weare, NH  03281
> >> 603-529-1100
> >> ************************************************************************
> >> ************************************************************************
> >> ************************************************************************
> >>
> >> 
> >
> >
> >
> >************************************************************************
> >************************************************************************
> >************************************************************************
> >The personal submersibles mailing list complies with the US Federal
> >CAN-SPAM Act of 2003.  Your email address appears in our database
> >because either you, or someone you know, requested you receive messages
> >from our organization.
> >
> >If you want to be removed from this mailing list simply click on the
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> >
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> >
> >PSUBS.ORG
> >PO Box 53
> >Weare, NH  03281
> >603-529-1100
> >************************************************************************
> >************************************************************************
> >************************************************************************
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ************************************************************************
> ************************************************************************
> ************************************************************************
> The personal submersibles mailing list complies with the US Federal
> CAN-SPAM Act of 2003.  Your email address appears in our database
> because either you, or someone you know, requested you receive messages
> from our organization.
> 
> If you want to be removed from this mailing list simply click on the
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> 
> Removal of your email address from this mailing list occurs by an
> automated process and should be complete within five minutes of
> our server receiving your request.
> 
> PSUBS.ORG
> PO Box 53
> Weare, NH  03281
> 603-529-1100
> ************************************************************************
> ************************************************************************
> ************************************************************************
> 
> 




************************************************************************
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The personal submersibles mailing list complies with the US Federal
CAN-SPAM Act of 2003.  Your email address appears in our database
because either you, or someone you know, requested you receive messages
from our organization.

If you want to be removed from this mailing list simply click on the
link below or send a blank email message to:
	removeme-personal_submersibles@psubs.org

Removal of your email address from this mailing list occurs by an
automated process and should be complete within five minutes of
our server receiving your request.

PSUBS.ORG
PO Box 53
Weare, NH  03281
603-529-1100
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