Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] submarine kit-builder's society

[Jon Wallace <jonw@psubs.org>]

Hi Wil,

I think there is plenty of room for custom design of many components, 
and certainly the overall outward appearance of a sub, while keeping in 
step with recommended fabrication procedures and safety features defined 
by ABS or similar certifying authorities.  I have to disagree with your 
supposition that safety does not come from stamping because it misses 
the point that authorities such as ABS, have already done the "solid 
testing and solid overbuild" for us over years and years of analysis and 
experiment.  Your statement that "safety comes from solid testing" 
appears to be a perfect endorsement of following standards and 
guidelines as published by a certifying authority such as ABS.  There's 
good reason for lay people to build a standard pressure vessel, that 
looks and feels like a standard pressure vessel, if in fact that 
standard pressure vessel is going to reliably get them to their intended 
dive depth and back to the surface safely and consistently.  I think you 
put too much emphasis on the idea that everyone must want a unique 
vessel completely different than anyone else.  In large part, this can 
be done via a facade over the pressure hull built to solid standards.  
So let me ask you then, if tomorrow morning you had 100 orders for your 
concrete submarine, would they all be constructed in the same identical 
shape as you have done for Ian?  Would they not all have the same look, 
feel, and be a "teardrop concrete submarine"?  Who would want to have 
one?  Who would want to sail one?

Jon



Wilfried Ellmer wrote:
> Safety is NOT the same as "Standard conform" - safety does not come 
> from stamping - safety comes from solid testing and solid overbuild. 
> No matter if it is standard conform or not.
>
> The sea does not know if your hull is stamped, approved, standard 
> conform...whatever...it just finds your crush depth - stay 
> sufficiently away from it - 1:3 - testing is the key.
>
> If you want to build a sub according to a "industrial pressure vessel 
> standard" it will look, feel, and basicly - be, a "industrial pressure 
> vessel" - who is really dreaming about "industrial pressure vessels" ?
>
> Who wants to have one? Sail one?
>
> What is psubs.org <http://psubs.org> good for if it is only a pointer 
> to a "industrial pressure vessel standard" ? - if you restrict free 
> concepts you are basicly out of business.
>
> Why does Phil Nuytten who really has built a lot of subs recommend not 
> to go for ABS (not worth it) ?
>
> Wil
> concretesubmarine.com <http://concretesubmarine.com>




************************************************************************
************************************************************************
************************************************************************
The personal submersibles mailing list complies with the US Federal
CAN-SPAM Act of 2003.  Your email address appears in our database
because either you, or someone you know, requested you receive messages
from our organization.

If you want to be removed from this mailing list simply click on the
link below or send a blank email message to:
	removeme-personal_submersibles@psubs.org

Removal of your email address from this mailing list occurs by an
automated process and should be complete within five minutes of
our server receiving your request.

PSUBS.ORG
PO Box 53
Weare, NH  03281
603-529-1100
************************************************************************
************************************************************************
************************************************************************