RE: Getting Paid.... Performing UW services seems like an awful hard way to make a buck.... There are other 'non-traditional' routes that could be explored. Getting sponsorship for a project like Scott's 'get eaten by a squid :)' mission. It looks like the X-prize foundation is working on some new prizes in the ocean field: http://www.xprize.org/future-x-prizes/exploration SBIR (small business innovative research) grants offer real money ($100K - $500K). From time to time there are topics in the NAVY/NOAA solicitations which are relevant to manned submersible technology. Treasure hunting is of course always an option...... -a -----Original message----- From: "Brian Cox" ojaivalleybeefarm@dslextreme.com Date: Fri, 09 Jan 2009 11:37:12 -0700 To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Idabel and HY-100 > Maybe there could be some work in the global warming industry ! > > Brian > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org > [mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org]On Behalf Of > vbra676539@aol.com > Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 9:27 AM > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Idabel and HY-100 > > > Considering that HBOI has virtually suspended submersible operations, and > that not one but two small sub crews managed to eke a living from > submersibles for the last 20 years in California, I believe that it is > possible to extrapolate enough work for a three-man team. Especially if, to > augment the grocery money, they were willing to untangle the occasional > prop, paint the occasional bottom or jet in and/or repair a few sea wall > bulkheads behind a rich guy's house. Full time might be a problem, but there > are definitely contracts out there--maybe not big enough to pay $16K/day for > ship and crew, but probably big enough to pay $3500/day and supply their own > boat. > > Jago stays fairly busy out of Germany (mostly with internal money, I > think), and Phil Nuyton keeps the electric bill paid with first one thing > and then another, so there is definitely some work for the little guy. The > major players are falling by the wayside in manned operations, but as Phil > says: "ROVs are like phone sex. It just ain't the same when you aren't > there." Scientists especially love to be there, and right now there's maybe > a vacuum of opportunity. > > Given that, I think a small sub with a SOO (ship of opportunity) and light > enough not to require ABS certified cranes could conceivably make a living, > especially one run by someone with a lifetime in the biz and lots of > contacts. Just look at Delta. Besides, as I said, it's fiction, so let me > assure you, these guys DO make a living, more or less. > > Vance > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Joseph Perkel <joeperkel@hotmail.com> > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org > Sent: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 11:09 am > Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Idabel and HY-100 > > > "....fictionalized but realistic sub equivelant to Delta or Aquarius that > would triple their depth numbers..." > > "....but they aren't oil field tough...." > > Vance, > > I've seen your references to the oil industry on a number of occasions. > Given a hypothetical certification of something like your recipe there, is > it safe to say that both oil and academia, would provide enough work to keep > the boat, "afloat",..so to speak? > > Joe > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Idabel and HY-100 > Date: Fri, 9 Jan 2009 09:52:59 -0500 > From: vbra676539@aol.com > > Szbowski (If that's you, then who is Brent?), > > I guess my question is still: Why not build the whole thing in HY-100, > rather than deal with the change in strengths? I've been talking to Karl, > developing a lightweight, fictionalized but realistic sub equivelant to > Delta or Aquarius that would triple their depth numbers. Karl has proven > that it can be done reasonably (or as reasonable as these things ever get). > However, the fictional version would need certification, and there are some > things about Idabel they probably wouldn't pass. So, I'm thinking a witch's > brew: take a little Perry, add a pinch of Nuyton, salt with some Delta and > bring to a boil with a little Idabel. > > The Tritons are pretty and the Seamagines are...well, imaginative, but > they aren't oil field tough, and so I'm sticking with steel and guard rails. > Besides, even an HY-100 hull would be cheaper than a 5 1/2 foot acrylic ball > with hatch and penetrator plate built and tested. I'm guessing this little > book sub could be built for about what a Triton 1000 meter pressure hull > costs--a quarter million, say, or a little better. And a completed > 2-passenger 1000 meter Triton goes for over $2 million, according to the web > page. > > Phil says an HY-100 Aquarius hull could conceivably do 1km, give or take. > That gives me a 7000# sub able to do a LOT! And remember, it's fiction, so I > can do what I want. The problem is that the psubs community and the > professionals out there will tear strips off me if I take any liberties with > what they know to be true, or even nearly true. They don't suffer fools > lightly. And besides, my mind doesn't work that way. I want the thing to be > accurate, however fanciful it might seem to an outsider. > > Vance > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brent Hartwig <brenthartwig@hotmail.com> > To: PSUBSorg <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> > Sent: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 6:53 pm > Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Jurassic Shark will air soon on National > Geographic > > > > > > Hi Vance, > > They are 3/4" thick, with some thickness changes in some areas do to hot > stamping them. I'm looking for that data now so I can run some additional > FEA work on Idabel for Karl when I get a couple other projects finished. > Steel plate grain direction may also be a factor. The previous FEA work done > for Karl some time back, had used a perfect 3/4" thickness through out, and > a pretty large element size. Depending on the size of the assembly, and the > number of different materials in the assembly, I can pars a pretty small > element size with my current CAD computer, which in turn will produce more > accurate results. I'm getting ready to switch over to Windows 64 Bit XP, so > I can increase my CAD computers RAM to 8 Gigs. Then I can run much larger > assemblies with out having to leave it to pars all night, then just crash > near the end of it. > > > "They were built using HY-100 steel rather than HY-80 steel which is what > previous classes had used." > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seawolf_class_submarine > > > "HY-80 is a high yield strength (minimum of 80 ksi) , low carbon, low > alloy steel with nickel, molybdenum and chromium. It has excellent > weldability and notch toughness along with good ductility even in welded > sections. " > > http://www.suppliersonline.com/propertypages/HY80.asp > > > > > Regards, > Szybowski > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Jurassic Shark will air soon on National > Geographic > Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 07:24:10 -0500 > From: vbra676539@aol.com > > HY-80? Any idea how thick? Thanks for the update. > Vance > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brent Hartwig <brenthartwig@hotmail.com> > To: PSUBSorg <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> > Sent: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 8:31 pm > Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Jurassic Shark will air soon on National > Geographic > > > > > Hey Vance, > > Karl likes an adventure so he might let you drive. You'll just have to ask > him. I know there are a couple areas where he dives that have some serious > entanglement issues, but he would be able to tell you were those are, so you > can stay clear. I only know of one veiwport failure on Idabel. The lower > flat window had at first a bad design and it caused the window to flex > unevenly. That was changed in the last refit. There were a couple other > viewports that failed in the C-BUG. One reason for those Karl said the > conning tower bases needed more reinforcement, so there wouldn't be as much > flex as there was. The conning towers will be upgraded in the C-BUG 102 > model. > > The main large dome window has another thinner dome over it the serves as > a front MBT and dome protector. So the scratches to the dome the guy talks > about are on the outer MBT dome. I'll have to double check my data when I > get on my other computer, but I pretty sure all three spheres are made from > hot stamped HY-80. I don't know about the connecting rings. All the > weldments were stress relieved twice. > > > > > > > > Regards, > Szybowski > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Jurassic Shark will air soon on National > Geographic > Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 21:16:17 -0500 > From: vbra676539@aol.com > > The narrator is right (eventually!) about the shark's sensitivity to a > sub's electrical field. They just don't act like that normally. I've spent > thousands of hours underwater in subs and can count on my hands the number > of sharks that I have seen close up through a viewport. If they had hair, > I'd suspect it would be standing up like a static charge will do to a > mammal. The light blinds them, and the bait saturates their smell-o-vision, > so I'd suspect the behavior filmed is a result of that land critter that > Karl talks about baiting with. Otherwise, the sharks would be getting the > heck out of Dodge, and pronto. > > They baited 6-gills off Bermuda for a couple of years, using a Pisces to > do direct observation, but they kept the sub back a bit. Then HBOI ran into > one, or rather it ran into them, a couple of years back, and had kind of the > same experience with the animal blundering around and hitting stuff. Those > folks were some rattled at the time, and maybe still are. Still, it would be > seriously cool to see those big dummies down there. And mostly you ain't > going to do it any other way except in the Stanleymobile. > > What worries me is that the web page says Idabel has had four port > failures, fractures large enough to spurt water onto the paying customers. > I'd be renting me some strain gauges and a test tank, if it was me. > Something is moving too much in there. It seems like I read that the forward > sphere is HY100 and the other two are something else. The only thing I know > about that is that the Navy refused to classify the old Deep Diver because > of disparate metals in the aft DLO compartment, and the sub never worked > again in anything deeper than about 300'. > > Still, I'd love to see those sharks... Wonder if Karl would let me drive? > > Vance > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brent Hartwig <brenthartwig@hotmail.com> > To: PSUBSorg <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> > Sent: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 7:00 pm > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Jurassic Shark will air soon on National > Geographic > > > > > I just got these links from Karl. The Discovery Channel and National > Greographic Channel will air this material very soon. > > > http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/series/dangerous-encounters/3904/Ove > rview#tab-Videos/06223_00 > > http://blogs.discovery.com/deep_sea_news/2009/01/6-gill-sharks-a.html > > > > Szybowski > > > > = > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > Get a free MP3 every day with the Spinner.com Toolbar. Get it Now. > = > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > Get a free MP3 every day with the Spinner.com Toolbar. 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