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i have pictures of a sub built in 1970 ,made from a
500gal propaine tank, it has no ribs and has been to the bottom of lake
michigan, lester from michigan ,ill put some pictures on
moki
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, January 02, 1904 4:46
PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re:
"working" Disney(ish) Nautilus has aPropane Tank Hull.
Jim ,
My last message got sent before it was
complete.
Subs built from propane tanks have very limited value. Probably
just scrap metal prices. Take the sub to a public scale , times the weight by
1 1/2 cents per pound and you have the value. This topic has been beat
to death on this forum before. Just look in the archives.
Dan Lance
From: Jim Pesanka <jpesanka@yahoo.com>
Reply-To:
personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Date: Tue, 7 Jun 2005 22:21:27
-0700 (PDT)
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject:
RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re: "working" Disney(ish) Nautilus has a Propane
Tank Hull.
Hi everyone, and thanks for your replies so far. Very
helpful.
I've just learned that the Ebay sub has a modified propane
tank for its pressure hull. I believe there have been discussions
about that very subject here before. Is anyone willing to briefly
outline the pros and cons of using a propane tank as the basic pressure hull
for a psub?
Also, I'm interested in your discussion of oval shaped
pressure hulls, especially since the tower on the Ebay sub is oval shaped,
and sits on a large oval shaped hole in the propane tank hull. Am I
correct in assuming that might decrease hull strength against
presssure?
And can anyone tell me what a fair price of a Kittredge
K-250 submarine might be? I've learned the Ebay sub takes much of it's
design from the K-250. The owner says similar subs sell for
$100,000.00, and he is asking $45,000.00 for the Ebay sub. Does that
sound about right?
Thanks to everyone for the assistance. This
is a great place to get information about psubs.
Jim
solomon D <solomondees@yahoo.com>
wrote:
I can see what you mean about this ebay submarine. It
looks
as if it was built mainly for looks with no real
intentions of it
diving. There seems to be no kind of
internal bracing that a pressure
hull should have. If
you added all the additional bracing,
drive
system,controls and equipment needed to really dive
there
wouldnt be any room left for a pilot. The view
ports seem to be an
after thought just cut out and
bolted on. Who knows how well the welds
were done? I
doubt that it is even water tight on the
surface.
--- Alec Smyth wrote:
> I'm afraid I
wouldn't touch it, sorry. Often people
> come up with ideas
>
about subs that should look cool, like say a fighter
> plane or some
Star
> Wars space craft. They then try to design something
>
to match the
> particular loo! k they have in mind. But I think
subs
> should be designed
> in exactly the opposite way; the
laws of physics and
> the limitations of
> materials dictate
most decisions, and the appearance
> (unfortunately) is
> a
bit of a by-product. This sub is an entirely
> aesthetics-driven
design.
> Notice the endcaps made of flat plate wedges, for
>
example? Those would
> surely concentrate stresses. I would worry
that if
> someone's primary
> motivation is the "look" of a
sub, they probably
> have not done any
> stress calculations,
used appropriate materials,
> done full penetration
> welds,
put just the right depth on an o-ring groove,
> etc., etc. The
last
> thing you want in a submarine is to go etcetera
>
hunting.
>
> It looks like it's nicely made, and may even
dive
> safely to a few feet,
> but can anyone tell how many? I
would not want to be> the one to find
> out.
>
>
:-(
>
> Alec
>
> -----Original
Message-----
> From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>
[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org] On
> Behalf Of Jim
Pesanka
> Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 5:29 AM
> To:
personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re: 1
(2?) man
> "working" Disney(ish)
> Nautilus sub on
ebay
>
> Thanks Ian. Very informative, and I appreciate
the
> effort you went to.
> You've given me much to think
about that I wouldn't
> have realized on my
> own.
>
> Would anyone else care to comment on the Ebay sub
> please?
I'd like to
> gather as many opinions as I can. Perhaps some
of
> you with actual
> experience? Dan, Carsten, Alec. Vance,
or others?
> And also those who
> may have not actually built
a psub yet but have
> spent some time
> designing them. Does
the Ebay Nautilus sub look
> like a good one to you
> or not,
and why?
>
> I guess what I'm asking is, "What should
an
> inexperienced prospective
> buyer (like me) be aware of
about this particular
> type of submarine?"
>
> Only
five days left in the auction.
>
> Cheers!
>
>
Jim
>
> Ian Roxborough wrote:
>
> Welcome,
Jim.
>
> The "K250/350 hybrid" was a submarine that was
for
> sale on ebay
> in
> late 2004. It was close
(rather subjective) to my
> house so I
> took
> a look
to see if it was worth buying. It was made
> from K250
>
plans,
> but with lots of changes from the builder (some
>
bad), it also
> had
> some K350 styling such as the conning
tower. The
> picture are on
> the moki picture exchange under
"2 person k250".
>
> Internal framing. Most pressure vessel
have ribs
> along the
> inside
> (or outside) of the
pressure vessel. These are very
> important
> and
> are
the only reason the sub can dive deep without
> being
crushed.
> If you look at this picture in the K250 hybrid I
>
was talking
> about:
>
>
http://www.prismnet.com/~moki/20041127.134008/Kx50_hybrid5.jpg
>
You seen "hoops" on the inside of the
> pressure-vessel
spaced
> every
> so often. If you look at the picture of of
the na!
> utilus sub:
>
>
http://www.prismnet.com/~moki/20050605.153205/f9_3.JPG
>
There are no "hooks" space every so often. There is
> a band
on
> the
> inside, maybe it's for mounting equipment, but
it
> won't provide
> much re-enforcement of the pressure
vessel (even if
> there where
> many of them). This is big
reason! I would not dive
> in it. Maybe
> it's safe to pop
under the water can come back up,
> but without
> proper
ribbing it will have a shallower colapse
> depth. The
>
colapse depth can be calculated, but any out of
> roundness in
the
> hull will reduce it further.
>
> "little
bottles". I meant little bolts (sorry I was
> sleepy) as
> in
nuts'n'bolts. They go all the way thru the view
> port
housing
> from the inside to the outside. This means
drilling
> holes in the
> viewports. As well as more holes in
the sub...
>
> I think the peddle power is via a hand
crank.
> Rather than foot
> peddles. The prop looks pretty,
but my gut says
> that sub won't
> go over 1knot under it's
own power.
>
> "never been underwater yet" means you are
buying a
> pile of
> submarine
> shaped scrap metal. You
will be the one that makes
> it a
> submarine,
> by
removing what is wrong, sanding the paint and
> inspecting
all
> the
> welds, grinding out and re-welding where
needed,
> fitting the
> missing
> components, adjusting
things for short comings in
> the design...
> I don't mean to
put you off, just give you an idea
> of what you
> are
>
getting into. I would do it if I found the right
> sub.
>
> I like the two large side viewports. It looks like
> it
might be
> the same as the forward big viewport. This is a
>
change I that
> I've
> often thought would be nice on the
K350, but the
> would have to
> be
> bigger housing
inside the sub in order to support
> the ribs that
>
it
> would need to disrupt.
>
> Hope this
helps,
> Ian.
>
> On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 14:59:27 -0700
(PDT)
> Jim Pesanka wrote:
>
> ! t; Hello everyone,
> >
> > My name is Jim and I have ! been a member
of
> Psubs for a
> while. I have a genuine interest in
submarines and
> especially the
> personal variety, though I
have not actually built
> one yet. I've enjoyed
> reading the
messages I've found here, but this is
> the first time I've
>
had a reason to actually post one myself. I have a
> question, but
first
> allow me to express my congratulations to your new
>
psub owner, Pierre,
> on his recent success with the submersible
"Big". I
> look
=== message truncated
===
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