Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re: 1 (2?) man "working" Disney(ish) Nautilus sub on ebay

[Ian Roxborough <irox@ix.netcom.com>]

Welcome, Jim.

The "K250/350 hybrid" was a submarine that was for sale on ebay in
late 2004.  It was close (rather subjective) to my house so I took
a look to see if it was worth buying.  It was made from K250 plans,
but with lots of changes from the builder (some bad), it also had
some K350 styling such as the conning tower.  The picture are on
the moki picture exchange under "2 person k250".

Internal framing.  Most pressure vessel have ribs along the inside
(or outside) of the pressure vessel.  These are very important and
are the only reason the sub can dive deep without being crushed.
If you look at this picture in the K250 hybrid I was talking about:
http://www.prismnet.com/~moki/20041127.134008/Kx50_hybrid5.jpg
You seen "hoops" on the inside of the pressure-vessel spaced every
so often.  If you look at the picture of of the nautilus sub:
http://www.prismnet.com/~moki/20050605.153205/f9_3.JPG
There are no "hooks" space every so often.  There is a band on the
inside, maybe it's for mounting equipment, but it won't provide
much re-enforcement of the pressure vessel (even if there where
many of them).  This is big reason I would not dive in it.  Maybe
it's safe to pop under the water can come back up, but without
proper ribbing it will have a shallower colapse depth.  The
colapse depth can be calculated, but any out of roundness in the
hull will reduce it further.

"little bottles".  I meant little bolts (sorry I was sleepy) as
in nuts'n'bolts.  They go all the way thru the view port housing
from the inside to the outside.  This means drilling holes in the
viewports.  As well as more holes in the sub...

I think the peddle power is via a hand crank.  Rather than foot
peddles.  The prop looks pretty, but my gut says that sub won't
go over 1knot under it's own power.

"never been underwater yet" means you are buying a pile of submarine
shaped scrap metal.  You will be the one that makes it a submarine,
by removing what is wrong, sanding the paint and inspecting all the
welds, grinding out and re-welding where needed, fitting the missing
components, adjusting things for short comings in the design...
I don't mean to put you off, just give you an idea of what you are
getting into.  I would do it if I found the right sub.

I like the two large side viewports.  It looks like it might be
the same as the forward big viewport.  This is a change I that I've
often thought would be nice on the K350, but the would have to be
bigger housing inside the sub in order to support the ribs that it
would need to disrupt.

Hope this helps,
  Ian.

On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 14:59:27 -0700 (PDT)
Jim Pesanka <jpesanka@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Hello everyone, 
>  
> My name is Jim and I have been a member of Psubs for a while.  I have a genuine interest in submarines and especially the personal variety, though I have not actually built one yet.  I've enjoyed reading the messages I've found here, but this is the first time I've had a reason to actually post one myself.  I have a question, but first allow me to express my congratulations to your new psub owner, Pierre, on his recent success with the submersible "Big".  I look forward to seeing pictures of it.
>  
> To my question: it concerns the Nautilus sub on Ebay.  It's not often a submarine comes up for sale.  There is some interest in buying this one, but many of us have little understanding of what a sub like this should (or should not) be like.  We would appreciate the observations of those with more knowledge than we possess.  
>  
> I found Ian and Mike's comments informative.  Thank you both.  
>  
> Ian,  Could you explain what a K250/350 hybrid is?  And would you expand on the lack of "internal framing" you mentioned?  Also the "little bottles" at the viewports, please?  And especially your comment that you "wouldn't dive in it": This leads me to think it might be unsafe.  Obviously, that's important to any of us thinking of buying this sub.  Please give us some reasons why you feel that way, if you will.
>  
> Mike, you made some enlightening observations as well.  Please go into a little greater depth on the subject, will you?  (Oh my!  I honestly did not intend a pun there, but the deed is done.)
>  
> Will everyone here, please, take a look at the Ebay auction and the pictures of this sub, and give us your thoughts and observations?  Does this look like a well designed and soundly built submarine we should feel safe in, or not?  And in either case, why?
>  
> Other questions include: "What is the importance of the seller's statement that this sub has never been underwater yet?" and "What do you estimate a fair price for this submarine to be?"  
>  
> I'm wondering about it being "pedal powered".  I assume that means it works like a bicycle, and would like to know how efficient that would be in a sub of this size and weight, especially with the propeller being of the unusual type shown?  What would you all estimate the top speed of such a vessel to be, if that's possible to determine?
>  
> With what can be known of the submarine from available information, is it possible to determine how reliable it might be underwater, and what depths it might successfully attain?
>  
> Any other comments and observations you'd care to make will be appreciated, and could be very important to someone's safety, so please don't hold back or worry about being "politically correct".  If you think this is a good sub, please say so and explain why.  If not, we need to know that, too.  
>  
> I'd also beg for this topic to receive some priority from the group, as the auction will only be up for a limited time.  Your comments may be vitally important, and time is of the essence.  Thank you.
>  
> Cheers!
>  
> Jim 
>  
> 
> Michael Holt <mholt@ohiohills.com> wrote:
> Ian Roxborough wrote:
> 
> > It reminds me a little of the K250/350 hybird, but with no internal
> > framing. The same skinny viewport housings. Maybe the builder had
> > seen a set of K250 plans. The inside picture has a shot of the
> > viewport housing, with little bottles that appear to go all the way
> > thru the housing! Looks pretty, I wouldn't dive in it.
> 
> I'd kinda like to talk with him. Does that address on ebay really
> work? I've had some trouble with ebay addresses.
> 
> Pedal-powered, he suggests. No propulsion system is fitted, it
> seems. I bet it's planned to do nothing more than dip a few feet
> under the surface.
> 
> In the background of one image, there's what looksl ike a small
> replica of a steam locomotive. The sub may have been nothing
> more than a welding project for him.
> 
> Thanks, Ian.
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> ************************************************************************
> ************************************************************************
> ************************************************************************
> The personal submersibles mailing list complies with the US Federal
> CAN-SPAM Act of 2003. Your email address appears in our database
> because either you, or someone you know, requested you receive messages
> from our organization.
> 
> If you want to be removed from this mailing list simply click on the
> link below or send a blank email message to:
> removeme-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> 
> Removal of your email address from this mailing list occurs by an
> automated process and should be complete within five minutes of
> our server receiving your request.
> 
> PSUBS.ORG
> PO Box 311
> Weare, NH 03281
> 603-529-1100
> ************************************************************************
> ************************************************************************
> ************************************************************************
> 
> 
> 		
> ---------------------------------
> Discover Yahoo!
>  Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out!



************************************************************************
************************************************************************
************************************************************************
The personal submersibles mailing list complies with the US Federal
CAN-SPAM Act of 2003.  Your email address appears in our database
because either you, or someone you know, requested you receive messages
from our organization.

If you want to be removed from this mailing list simply click on the
link below or send a blank email message to:
	removeme-personal_submersibles@psubs.org

Removal of your email address from this mailing list occurs by an
automated process and should be complete within five minutes of
our server receiving your request.

PSUBS.ORG
PO Box 311
Weare, NH  03281
603-529-1100
************************************************************************
************************************************************************
************************************************************************