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I know what you mean Solomon. It is hard to find
people who are interested in science and specifically submarine
construction.
Once America had a great educational system. Then
our educational standards were lowered so that a small segment of the
school
popluation that had been previously educationally
disadvantaged could pass and advance more easily. That has helped dumb our
population down.
Except for special programs like the history
channel and a handfull of others, our television which has become a babysitter
and teacher to millions of
youngsters teaches them mindless garbage that does
not really educate them in a proper way at all. I know we still have a lot of
highly intelligent
youngsters today who will educate themselves by
reading and having their own internal drive to learn much like I did, but they
are rare within the masses.
I think part of the problem is exposure. If a young
person is exposed to interesting science projects by an adult and involved with
that adult in working on
projects, then I think that young person will be
much more interested in the subject than if they just see a quick program on
t.v. about it. I believe companies or
individuals involved with scientific projects like
subs or anything really, should have an apprentice program so that young people
can get hands on instruction
and education from the older masters and one day
become the new masters themselves. Kind of like the apprenticeships of times
gone bye. Sadly a large part of our
population will never care about the things we
discuss at this forum. They don't have a clue because they were either never
exposed to ideas like we discuss and even if some
of them were they did not have the education to
understand it and therefore get bored because they do not understand and go back
to discussing football.
There is not much we can do but keep the faith and
try to take a kid under our wing who shows promise when we can.
Kindest Regards,
Bill Akins.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 9:05
PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Crazy
idea.
I dont think that the force can be redirected in
that
manner.It seems to me that the pressure would travel
into the tubes
but would not have any measurable
effect in an outward direction. The
pressure would
just be trying its best to burst every one of those
tubes
so they would have to be as thick as your hull.
I like the fact that you
are thinking about new ideas
though. It seems that no one reads or thinks
anymore.
All that is in their head is who won last nights
basketball
game and how they cant wait to get off work
so they can get drunk. Every
time I mention submarines
or anything remotely intresting they either give
me
strange looks or change the subject back to football.
Oh yeah and
Newtons law is not a law at all its just a
working theory. :)
--- Akins
<lakins1@tampabay.rr.com>
wrote:
> That's why I called it a craaazy idea.
>
> I
know each curved tube would be a seperate pressure
> vessel of sorts or
possibly the inside surface of
> the hull where the tube welds against
the inside of
> the hull would be the pressure vessel. What I am
>
wondering is....wouldn't there be pressure
>
> against the inside
surface of the hull where the
> tube terminates against it? I picture
the pressure
> in the curved tubes pushing inward in all
directions
> within the tube, so wouldn't that also push SOME
>
against the inner surface of the hull outwardly?
>
> I picture
hundreds of thick curved tubes shaped like
> sink traps open to the
outside on one end and
> penetrating the hull wherein the other end is
then
> welded to the inner surface of the main pressure
> hull.
Since the pressure in the tubes would be
>
> the same pressure
exerted against the entire main
> hull, I again come back to the
question....would
> there be any pressure AT ALL exerted against
the
> inside surface of the hull where the tube
>
terminates? If this worked I know it would be
>
problematic
>
> but I am just interested in the theory. I know
for
> each action there is an equal and opposite reaction.
> In
this case pressure is the action and resistance
> stress or implosion is
the reaction. What I am
> seeking is theoretically redirecting that
action so
> it
>
> becomes its own REaction and cancels
itself out. Now
> this is REALLY going to sound nuts, but what
would
> Isaac Newton say if he had knowledge of antimatter's
>
existance and you posed the question of what would
> happen if you fired
two projectiles
>
> of equal weight head on into each other and
one was
> made of matter and the other of antimatter?
> According
to Newton something has to give right? But
> not in that case. They
would simply cancel each
> other out. Now I know antimatter has nothing
to do
> with
>
> what we are talking about here, but It
just may be
> possible that Newton's law could be violiated and
is
> not a total absolute. But I'm sure I'm missing
> something
here and not about to violate Newton's
> law. Again, would there be any
pressure exerted
> against the inside of
>
> the hull
pushing outwardly in my above curved tube
> scenereo?
>
> Kindest Regards,
>
> Crazy Bill.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
gordon alexander
> To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:08 AM
>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Crazy idea.
>
>
>
This might confuse some folks. This is a
> completely different thing
than Bill was thinking
> of. Bill was using only ambient pressures
and
> counting the forces in helpful directions and at
> least
partially ignoring forces against the hull. He
> wasn't summing the
forces correctly. He was trying
> to violate Newtons third law.
>
> Gordon Alexander
>
> Ian
Roxborough wrote:
> Hi Bill,
>
> some research has been
done on this idea. But they
> are two main
> differences
between what you describe and the
> research I've read.
> First is
that rather than use a horse shoe shaped
> stiffener, the
>
stiffener has been made out of either a complete
> tube (i.e.
toroid),
> or a longer tube coiled around the inside of the
>
pressure vessel.
> The second change is that rather than exposing
the
> inside of the
> tube to external pressure, they are
pressurized to
> several times
> higher than the external
pressure.
>
> The book "Pressure Vessels - external
pressure
> Technology" by Carl
> T. F. Ross, discusses tube
stiffened pressure
> vessels on page 286.
> Later on (page 321)
there is an experiment using a
> tube stiffened
> dome in a
pressure test tank. The tubing was
> pressurized to 13bar
>
and the fail pressure of the dome was 3bar.
>
> The advantage of
the tube stiffened pressure-vessels
> is that if you
> increase
the internal tube pressure, you increase
> the crush depth.
>
> Anyway, it works, it has been done in laboratory
> conditions,
but
> I do not know of a non-test tube stiffened
>
pressure-vessel.
>
> Cheers,
> Ian.
>
>
> On Sat, 14 May 2005 08:25:13 -0400
> "Akins" <lakins1@tampabay.rr.com>
wrote:
>
> Hi forum.
>
> I just had a
craaaazy idea. This just jumped into my
> head and I wonder if anyone
has ever tried it or any
> research done on it.
>
> Suspose
you had a pressure hull with horseshoe
> shaped tubes penetrating the
hull all over its
> entire surface. Then suspose the water
>
> entered into the open ended OUTSIDE of those tubes
> and the
tubes were welded where they penetrated the
> hull and also against the
inside of the hull facing
> outward so the outside
>
>
water pressure enters the open end and is now
> pushing OUTWARD against
the inside of your hull.
> Would this work to counteract some of the
inward
> pressure on
>
> the hull? I was thinking of
a way to use water
> pressure to counteract itself by taking its
inward
> pushing pressure and curving back outward against
> the
inside of your pressure hull by use of horseshoe
> shaped tubes.
>
> Or am I missing something basic again about
> pressure?
>
> Kindest Regards,
>
> Bill Akins.
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