Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lead-Acid Oil-Filled Batteries and Catalysts

[SFreihof@aol.com]

Bill;

I'm sorry.  I assume too much sometimes.  Not everybody is familiar with chemistry.  Pb is the symbol for the metal  lead, found in the Periodic Table of Elements.  Go to www.webelements.com.  PbO2 would be lead oxide.

You're getting too hung up minutiae.

Stan 

In a message dated 2/3/2005 11:11:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, "Akins" <lakins1@tampabay.rr.com> writes:

>Hi Stan. You're right. I should have said if you dropped a WEIGHTED barrel of oil it would sink to the titanic without any pressure effects against it.
>
>You say your best guess is some of the oxygen is getting tied up in Pb and making PbO2. Ok. What is Pb Stan? Some kind of oxide? If it is and the
>
>hydrocaps wash it all down back into the battery cells, does the oxide just get shoved into the acid water mix? Is that bad?
>
>
>By having an air equalization system that will vent air into my pod whenever the pressure in my pod falls below the outside water
>
>pressure, I really shouldn't have to worry about the vacuum even though I will use hydrocaps. It just would be nice to know what causes that
>
>vacuum. But it sounds like it must be something like you are talking about Stan. I can understand if somehow ALL the original O2 that was
>
>seperated from the hydrogen is not available to recombine with the hydrogen it seperated from, then of course other O2 from within the pod
>
>would recombine with the hydrogen. The missing O2 that was originally seperated from the hydrogen must be what is causing the vacuum
>
>and that is what is bonding with the Pb and making PbO2. So even though I do not know what Pb is....I can still grasp that the original O2 that
>
>seperated from the hydrogen, now has more than likely bonded with something and is not available to recombine with the hydrogen it originally
>
>seperated from so water can be recreated. So the OTHER O2 that was not the original O2 that was seperated, has to recombine with the hydrogen
>
>and take up the slack for the missing O2. And that is what creates the vacuum. I understand the concept now even if I do not understand the exact chemical
>
>procedure that causes it. Shouldn't be a problem though with air equalization.
>
>
>
>Since the batteries do offgas during discharge but just not as much as when charging, then the hydrocaps should still be slightly hot or warm
>
>when the batteries are heavily discharging. Since heating the air inside the pod should make it expand somewhat, it seems like that should compensate
>
>for any small loss of O2 and prevent the vacuum doesn't it? I guess it doesn't cause the experts say you will have that slight vacuum when using
>
>hydrocaps, but it seems like heating the air would compensate some don't it? At least til the pod cooled down and the air contracted.
>
>Thanks for trying to help me get a handle on the cause of the vacuum Stan.
>
>Kindest Regards,
>Bill Akins.
>
>
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>
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>
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: SFreihof@aol.com
>  To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>  Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2005 1:13 PM
>  Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lead-Acid Oil-Filled Batteries and Catalysts
>
>
>  Don't get confused. A barrel of oil, with no air, will not sink to the Titanic. Oil is lighter than water and will float, not sink.
>
>  Hydrocaps are a catalyst which should not change the pressure in the battery pod. The catalyst simply combines hydrogen gas and oxygen gas to form water, without the explosion characteristic of this exothermic reaction. I suggested to you that another reaction may be causing the pressure drop. I suspect some oxygen (O2) is being tied up in PbO2:
>  Pb + O2 ---> PbO2
>  but that's a guess.
>
>  Relevant chemical reactions:
>
>  Pb + 2H2SO4 + PbO2 <---- Charging 2PbSO4 + 2H2O
>    Discharging---->
>
>  Hydrolysis: 2H2O ----> 2H2 + O2
>
>  I'm not sure why a vacuum happens, but knowing that it happens enables you to plan for it if you intend to use hydrocaps.
>
>  Stan
>
>



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