Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuttle Valve: Bad Idea

[irox <irox@ix.netcom.com>]

So your basically saying, captan goes down with his ship?
That might be fine for you, but I think most of us would like to
out live our hobbies... ;)

Or maybe you saying any sub is alway going to easy to recover before
 the air runs out....

 ... but a storm comes in and heavy lifting gear can't make it in time.
 ... but the sub is snagged on a piece of rope, full thrust but something
     over heats, there is a fire, your left with a crippled sub, no power,
     15 minutes of O2, 3 hours before your divers will think something
     is wrong.  Your only 30 feet under the surface, you can see your
     support boat, the electrical fire damaged the comms....  maybe after
     20 minutes of no comms a drive checks you out... five minutes too
     late.

They are 100s of things I don't want to go wrong, but if they do,
I don't want to depend on surface conditions, or response time
of a surface team, they might have more problems than me.

This isn't something I'll do for fun, "Oh screw it, I can't be bothered
waiting to surface, I'll just leave my sub here and swim home".  This
is when all else fails, then the drivers can't free my boat, then the
heavy lifting gear can't make it in time, on day three when weather
won't permitt another rescue attempt, when my O2 escaped because
I was sold a faulty valve, once all drop weights and thrusters have
been ejected, when all backup and backup-backup systems have
failed or can't be used because I didn't plan for what ever is
going wrong.... Then I will not sit in my boat and wait for death, I
flood my boat and make my way to the surface, maybe I still won't
make it, but I will have that chance, that option.

It's suicide to not include a flood valve, it's like saying, if I can't save
my sub, then I want to die with it. ( I don't think there is anything
wrong with by the way.)

Thanks,
  Ian.

-----Original Message-----
From: "adteleka@in-tch.com" <adteleka@in-tch.com>
Sent: Mar 10, 2004 10:43 AM
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuttle Valve: Bad Idea

Why are you guys so hell bent on getting out of your sub. Like you said
Dan, if you have a diver that can come down to assist you why do you
automatically think he has to assist you out of the sub? The best thing you
could ask for is an extra set of hands on the outside to untangle/cut
whatever. Unless you friction welded your sub to some underwater structure,
you pbobably have some serious design problems to deal with, which does not
include adding a suicide valve. Look at Kittredge's book where he talkes
about that guy who couldn't blow his tanks. Or when Capt. K misscalculated
displacement. (Where is Vance Bradley he should chime in on this one) The
sub I am most familliar with, in opperation today, has dived all over the
world over the last 20 years and it does not have a scuttle valve. Did the
designer forget to put one in, of course not, he knows its a bad idea. This
is a classic Psubs example (Jon and Ray have a great site) of where the
thinking stops too short.

Regards,
Adam 

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