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Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re: Compass instruments
Carsten,
as far as I recall,the gyro was integrated in the pilots dash pannel,
just forward of the turret. The sub was driven with push bottons from
the turret. The compass was located outside the bow acrylic dome,
so the copilot reading the compass cours to the pilot at pre dive, the
pilot set the gyro. To reset the gyro during dives,at this times
GPS was not in operation,same practice would be applyed, copilot reading the
course to the pilot. We had pingers beacons on the bottom and one pinger
beacon at the sub, and those acustic location devices gave position of the
sub to the topside, the mother ship would tell us via hydrophone our course.
Some times we would drive along a pipeline, were we knew the course it was
layed,and readjusted to that known course or to an anchor chain from an SMB
with the same results. But I remember that we drove the sub during dives in
the oilfields for about 1 to 2 hours before we would readjust the gyro. It
is different if you dive the oil fields, within a known location, and
perform inspection dives on mooring chains and pipelines, pipeline crossings
and under water manifold centers, risers and wellheads.
Go with your gyros and place an master gyro in the lower hull section in the
turret area. A digital compass for references,with the flux unit in the
sail. Most flux compasses for sailing vessels are liquid filled like a
compass, and those are O K outside ths sub. Even the Radar is run in a
liquid filled dome antenna on the outside.
>From: MerlinSub@t-online.de (Carsten Standfuss)
>Reply-To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re: Compass instruments
>Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 21:37:20 +0100
>
>Michael .. how was this setup be done - by a GPS signal course ?
>
>The last two day we build the main machinery beth for the Euronaut.
>Its in the ship now and will be in final place within the next few days.
>regards Carsten
>
>
>Michael Wludarczyk schrieb:
> >
> > Hi Carsten,
> > the aircraft gyros working fine in the sub,
> > I dove commercialy with a Perry 8-2 sub in the North Sea, and we had a
> > gyro, we would set it on pre dive check, and it worked fine through the
> > dive, normaly 3 - 6 hours down to 180 meters.
> > After it is set the first time, it will keep a good reading for a while.
> > If you want to use an external compass, use one from the ROV industry,
> > that will work great. You will find analog and digital ones and with
> > depth indication.
> > Take care, Mike W.
> >
> > >From: MerlinSub@t-online.de (Carsten Standfuss)
> > >Reply-To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> > >To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> > >Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re: Compass instruments
> > >Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 08:48:47 +0100
> > >
> > >The reason I want to use also the gyro is : I have them allready..
> > >Had purchase two or three at Ebay for between 30 - 80 euro..
> > >Also one elek.Horiziont. - Next step will be an aircraft intercom.
> > >
> > >Alec a fluxgate magnetic sensor can be pretty small - just put
> > >it on top of an small antenna.
> > >
> > >Sgt.Peppers has a diver-compass in front of the dome - but it never
> > >works because of the elec.currents in the bowthruster and the reason
> > >that he was to close to the (steel-) hull.
> > >
> > >The only other thing I can imagine - is a small pressure tight bouy
> > >on a 5 feet cable with the sensor in - or more for the techs - a
> > >hydraulic mast drives out only if you need a course inout..
> > >Change the hull material to GRP will be also a solution.. :-))
> > >
> > >regards Carsten
> > >
> > >
> > >Alec Smyth schrieb:
> > > >
> > > > I just re-read your message. My first response was in a bit of a
>rush,
> > >as my wife was calling from downstairs that the house was flooding due
>to
> > >the melting snow. But priorities are priorities, and I had to finish my
> > >PSUBS message!
> > > >
> > > > :)
> > > >
> > > > Anyway, between you and Cliff I'm really indebted for the research.
> > >Imagine if I went out and spent a couple of thousand dollars on an
>electric
> > >gyro only to find out what you just said about the 15 minute duration!
>But
> > >my question is this... if you put a fluxgate in the sail, it should
>work
> > >whether you're surfaced or submerged. What's the need for having a gyro
>as
> > >well?
> > > >
> > > > And less my earlier remark offend Cliff, I do want to mention my
> > >objection to an outside can is only a problem on Solo, because I don't
>have
> > >a sail in which to carry it cleanly. In his boat, the idea is perfectly
> > >sound. In fact he has been generous enough to share design
>documentation
> > >with me, and I should mention he puts me to shame in every way!
> > > >
> > > > cheers,
> > > >
> > > > Alec
> > > > PS: wife is calling to lunch now, gotta go.
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Alec Smyth on behalf of Alec Smyth
> > > > Sent: Sat 2/22/2003 12:20 PM
> > > > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> > > > Cc:
> > > > Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re: Compass instruments
> > > >
> > > > Funny, I wrote that last night and since then changed my opinion
>about
> > >how to attack this one. I am back behind Cliff's proposed approach,
>except
> > >I now envision a small acrylic dome open to the inside of the sub, as
> > >opposed to a separate "pod". I'm shooting to put the ez-compass-3 in it
> > >together with GPS sensor and a panning micro video camera.
> > > >
> > > > thanks,
> > > >
> > > > Alec
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Carsten Standfuss [mailto:MerlinSub@t-online.de]
> > > > Sent: Sat 2/22/2003 1:49 AM
> > > > To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
> > > > Cc:
> > > > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Re: Compass instruments
> > > >
> > > > Hi Alec, nice to hear from you - I still think that "Solo" is the
>best
> > > > choise for a name of a selfbuild onemansub ;-) The question is so
>good
> > > > that I transmit the answer to Psubs...
> > > >
> > > > I found out that an aircraft gyro need to be compensate all 10-15
> > > > minutes by a .. magnetic compass.. Its not a joke - on smaller
>crafts
> > > > the pilots do it by hand - fly straight course, same speed and level
> > > > than turn the compensate switch with his eyes looking on the
>magnetic
> > > > compass.
> > > >
> > > > On bigger or modern aircrafts this compensation is done automaticly
>by
> > > > an interlink between the gyro and the magnetic compass.. The reason
>for
> > > > that is that a ships gyro - which is north stabilzied needs some
>time
> > > > (hours) before he works properly - and is much bigger and heavier.
> > > >
> > > > I go this way : An aircaft gyro compensate by hand with the
>information
> > > > form a pretty small magnetic fluxgate sensor about 1.5 (5 feet) on
>top
> > > > of the sail at on one of the radio antennas.
> > > >
> > > > The only question concerned me : Is there a problem with the radio
>VHF
> > > > antenna and the fluxgate magnetic sensor ?
> > > >
> > > > See you Carsten
> > > >
> > > > Alec Smyth schrieb:
> > > > >
> > > > > Carsten,
> > > > >
> > > > > I've finished my power distribution panel and am now getting into
>the
> > >instrumentation for depth, life support, navigation, etc. One of the
>basic
> > >decisions is what to do about a compass.
> > > > >
> > > > > I see two possibilities; Cliff Redus's approach using an
>integrated
> > >circuit outside the hull, or an electric directional gyro inside the
>hull.
> > >I don't like the outside the hull approach because it would imply a
> > >hydrodynamic drag and might not even work given the amount of steel
>around.
> > > > >
> > > > > I remember a month or two ago you were asking about gyros. Did you
> > >find anything reasonably priced? D'you know if they can be interfaced
>to a
> > >PLC?
> > > > >
> > > > > thanks,
> > > > >
> > > > > Alec
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Name: winmail.dat
> > > > winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef
> > > > Encoding: base64
> >
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