Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] group submarine designing - good or bad.

["Steven Mills" <barycenter@earthlink.net>]

Warrend, with all this input you're virtually coordinating this
project now !  It kinda was your idea. Why not just step up
to the plate and be the obermeister...at least until things get
better organized and then it can be determined who should
oversee the project. So far, you're doing a good job in my
book. You're taking everyone's ideas and concerns and giving
it proper perspective and feedback.

There's my vote, --Steve


----- Original Message -----
From: Warrend Greenway <dub@linuxmail.org>
To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 12:58 PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] group submarine designing - good or bad.


> It would be open source in that it could be used for profit as long as any
improvements/
> info developed are put back into the project and made available for all.
It's non
> commercial in that the PSUBS.org group working on/guiding the project are
designing it
> specifically to meet the needs of all of us home builders. The project
will stagnate as
> you predict if a basic spec sheet isn't written quickly so that specific
areas of interest
> may be developed. I guided a few project in the past, and the trick was to
get into the
> dirty details as quickly as possible.
> 1. Who wants to build the speed controller?
> 2. Who wants to do the view-ports?
> 3. Life support, anyone?
> 4. Basic hull?
>
> The only thing the K class is supposed to do for us is give us something
to consider.
>
> 1. Is it large enough, or is it too small?
> 2. Is speed/range acceptable, or does it need to be improved.
> 3. Is it portable enough, or is that a concern?
> 4. Does it fit within average financial constraints?
> 5. Is manueverability acceptable?
>
> This is all the K class is supposed to do. You are entirely correct that
we have find
> ourselves in hot water if we ripped off the design. On the other hand, how
much of the
> K class technology is actually proprietary? Not much. We shouldn't spend
all our time
> talking over what a cool idea this all is, but rather focus on the
details, just as
> you suggested. For instance: I am quite capable of developing either the
"black-box"
> or the speed controller, or stepper controllers for rudder/duve plane
control. Just tell
> me what it needs to do exactly, how large a motor? What do you want the
black box to store
> and or display? Someone just needs to do the same with the hull. Who has
experience with
> sub pressure hulls? Who has fiberglass experience for fairings? etc.
>
> Warren.
>
> >
> >
> > "non commercial" vs open source.
> >
> > If it's "non commericial" then I don't see how it's open source.
> > There is no open source project that says you can not use it
> > for commerical use.  They are plenty of projects that provide
> > a "not for commerical use" version, sometimes with source code,
> > but this isn't an open source project and calling it an open
> > source project would dilute the (already over loaded) term
> > "open source".  - just my 2 cents.
> >
> >
> > Group submarine project.
> >
> > Wasn't there a couple of people (from this list?) who tried to
> > design a submarine together and after 3 years still had not
> > finish the specs stage?  (I heard this third hand so I could
> > be wrong).
> >
> >I'm not saying this is a bad idea, although the energy might
> > be better spent focusing on more specific areas of submarine
> > design, such as a motor control circuit (I remember Ken Martindale
> > posted Motor Controller Schematic
http://www.psubs.org/pic/motorcontrol.html),
> > or a trim tank control system, or Auto-Hover depth control like the
> > sport sub, or a black box dive recorded, or nice way of controlling
> > a spot lights direction from within the submarine.... etc..
> > I.e. things that are really useful to the submarine building
> > community.
> >
> >
> > K-350 vs open source.
> >
> > I don't recall George Kittredge open sourcing his K-350
> > design, which means that we don't have permission to create
> > works derived from any of Kittredge designs and then give
> > the plans away for free.  We could produce designs that
> > could be used with a K class, "Auto-hover depth control for
> > you K-250", but not redesign a K class and then give the
> > plans away.  I don't think anybody here would buy all the
> > rights for the K class off George and then open source it
> > either.
> >
> >
> > Talking vs work.
> >
> > I'm interesting in being a part of this idea, but not
> > until I see that real progress is possible.  I'm also
> > not convinced that it is a good idea to be a psubs
> > project, and that it may open psubs.org up to more
> > liability than the people running it would wish.
> >
> >
> > Ian.
>
> --
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