[PSUBS-MAILIST] Unconventional UW Propulsion YIKES!

["Gary R. Boucher" <protek@shreve.net>]

Adam,

     I also see two types of psubbers, but perhaps these two categories are 
not proper labels for them.  I know this is probably going to make some 
people upset with me.  But in about 2 weeks I have to go back to teaching 
and will probably lay low for a while.  Anyway, there are a lot of people 
that daydream about building their own airplane, sub, car, etc.  Most of 
the people who accomplish their quest are well grounded in the fundamentals 
and on occasion reach out for the different or unusual way of doing 
things.  This is good.  But many people bypass the fundamentals and go for 
the extreme technologies, having little idea how the technology works much 
less how to actually engineer it in final usable form.
     Daydreaming is good, but like resin and catalyst must be mixed in the 
right proportions to get a good final product.  I would encourage anyone 
who dreams of building anything to concentrate on the technology that is 
proven before assuming that exotic means can be implemented.  I well 
realize that I was the one to mention the flywheel concept the other day 
and create a whole new thread.  So I guess I have to slap my wrist 
too.  But, I would encourage the serious psubbers to come back to earth and 
think about what can be done with reasonable resources.  I would like to 
see psubs be more of an information exchange than a forum on extreme 
submersible philosophies.
     So I would create two categories also.

Group One:

     The serious designer-builder.  This person is attempting to determine 
the buoyancy, shape, number of batteries, optimal hatch design, framing, 
etc. for a real sub that can be potentially constructed.  This person will 
push the limits of innovation somewhat where safe, if need be, but stays 
close to home when it comes to design.  He or she draws from what others 
have done and learns the basics.

Group Two:

     The other group would be the dreamers, the people that perpetually 
look for the extreme and exotic methods with no interest in the outdated 
methods and practices used by the people that have been successful to 
date.  Group Two will achieve success only if somehow they can move first 
to Group One.

     It doesn't bother me for people to talk about what they want in 
"their" subs in regard to jet engines and steam turbines.  That's 
fine.  But many people who focus constantly on the extremes can not 
calculate the buoyancy of a cylinder.   Learn the basics first.  I had a 
fellow attempt to tell me how he was about to apply for a patent on a way 
to get more energy from batteries a few weeks ago.  I asked him what he did 
for a living.  He said, "I'm an inventor!"  I wanted to get up and walk out 
when he used the "I word," but stayed to hear it.  He had no idea how a 
battery worked much less how to make one last longer.
     My point; think about becoming a Group One.

G Boucher

P.S.  I am not talking about everyone that exchanges in exotic technology 
threads.  I too discuss H2O2 and flywheels on occasion.  But most of my 
posts are grounded in something that works, something that can be 
accomplished.




At 08:14 PM 8/10/00 , you wrote:
>Hi,
>
>I almost feel audacious making a comment on this thread as I have neither
>built or even attempted building a PSUB. However, I have been involved in
>several "homebuilt" hobbies and subscribed to even more home building mail
>lists. There appear to be two basic types of members on these lists
>(especially when science is involved), these types are:
>
>
>The Builder-
>
>The builder is a "get it done quickly, easily, and safely" kind of guy. He s
>interested in using present technology and information to build the sub
>which best suits his desires. While he may be willing to try new
>combinations of building methods/apparatus, he is usually not interested in
>revolutionizing the art. He just wants to be in the water with the sub he
>likes.
>
>
>The Experimenter-
>
>A very different ideology. Experimenters are people who aspire to apply new
>techniques to the art of PSUB'ing. They may be former "builders" who have
>become more interested in the underlying physical concepts of submarines and
>begin building experimental subs, or  they may simply muse their ideas on
>paper. Nonetheless, experimenters will be willing to go out of their way to
>try new (and sometimes orthodox /"unsafe") methods for sub building and
>operation. Will the sub of an experimenter may take longer to build, be more
>difficult to operate, and perform less; the experimenter still gets his
>edification because he is getting to apply his novel idea.
>
>Now, when these two types of builders meet their can often be some heated
>debate to follow simply because of different forms of thinking. After all,
>if someone asks, "How do I retrofit my sub w/ plasma burning dual intake
>surface engines?" they don't want to hear a response of, "Why would you want
>to?"
>
>I hope I haven't stepped on anyone's toes here, and mayb (just maybe) this
>can shed a bit of light on these arguments where "the other guy just doesn't
>get it."
>
>73's,
>
>Adam
>
>