From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Nov  5 17:59:08 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 5 Nov 2022 17:59:08 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fwd: U.S. Naval Institute Holiday Catalog Deals
	Start Now
In-Reply-To: <e971c577684d30446b18f75bf.243b5a2922.20221104181456.4ae2bd39e9.1b980044@mail111.atl231.mcsv.net>
References: <e971c577684d30446b18f75bf.243b5a2922.20221104181456.4ae2bd39e9.1b980044@mail111.atl231.mcsv.net>
Message-ID: <fe4a97e0-9174-793e-9922-b164a47c6ed4@ohiohills.com>




-------- Forwarded Message --------
Subject: 	U.S. Naval Institute Holiday Catalog Deals Start Now
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 09:07:22 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 14:07:22 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>

It's the time of year that we should start thinking about conventions and expeditions for 2023.? I'd like to see a bit more activity in this area and wonder if we should try to plan two events, a convention and an expedition.
Any feedback on locations, time of year?
Jon
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 10:11:56 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 05:11:56 -1000
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAODkcU8YaKr6fVVPUCq5ozc+QkgSuLBEK8oLWs_wto5+48gn_A@mail.gmail.com>

I vote Hawaii,,,Just kidding. no matter where it ends up Jon, is there a
way that others that can't make it watch some or all of it via skype? I
personally would like to get to know those in the group and put a face to a
post.

Thanks

Rick

On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 4:08 AM Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> It's the time of year that we should start thinking about conventions and
> expeditions for 2023.  I'd like to see a bit more activity in this area and
> wonder if we should try to plan two events, a convention and an expedition.
>
> Any feedback on locations, time of year?
>
> Jon
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 11:48:01 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 16:48:01 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>

 I would like to see go back to Islamorada Florida for an expedition in 2023.? Maybe we could get the Suhr's to let us use their house as a staging area again.??
Cliff
    On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 08:08:34 AM CST, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 It's the time of year that we should start thinking about conventions and expeditions for 2023.? I'd like to see a bit more activity in this area and wonder if we should try to plan two events, a convention and an expedition.
Any feedback on locations, time of year?
Jon
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 12:04:33 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 09:04:33 -0800
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAHHFyEGOG-Ewy4b9wKK=54y05YRmpL+nxupsViPzwJD9xjzjcw@mail.gmail.com>

I'm up for towing the Vast to Florida, not much farther than Michigan.

Best Regards,
David Colombo

804 College Ave
Santa Rosa, CA. 95404
(707) 536-1424
www.SeaQuestor.com



On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 8:49 AM Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> I would like to see go back to Islamorada Florida for an expedition in
> 2023.  Maybe we could get the Suhr's to let us use their house as a staging
> area again.
>
> Cliff
>
> On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 08:08:34 AM CST, Jon Wallace via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> It's the time of year that we should start thinking about conventions and
> expeditions for 2023.  I'd like to see a bit more activity in this area and
> wonder if we should try to plan two events, a convention and an expedition.
>
> Any feedback on locations, time of year?
>
> Jon
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 12:09:33 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 12:09:33 -0500
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CABECYQ7C1Dk--RwWG32gccj9vziHd2FRDaDEke71JEp-=erJxg@mail.gmail.com>

I'd be down for one trip to the keys and one to Bernie's! While ocean dives
are obviously very attractive, we did have several boats (including mine)
that were still in shakedown mode. For those, the logistics at a lake are
way more forgiving.

Alec

On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 11:49 AM Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> I would like to see go back to Islamorada Florida for an expedition in
> 2023.  Maybe we could get the Suhr's to let us use their house as a staging
> area again.
>
> Cliff
>
> On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 08:08:34 AM CST, Jon Wallace via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> It's the time of year that we should start thinking about conventions and
> expeditions for 2023.  I'd like to see a bit more activity in this area and
> wonder if we should try to plan two events, a convention and an expedition.
>
> Any feedback on locations, time of year?
>
> Jon
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 12:36:22 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 17:36:22 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <CABECYQ7C1Dk--RwWG32gccj9vziHd2FRDaDEke71JEp-=erJxg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CABECYQ7C1Dk--RwWG32gccj9vziHd2FRDaDEke71JEp-=erJxg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <353682637.1010011.1668101782918@mail.yahoo.com>

 I would be up for towing the R300 to either Islamorada Fl or Petoskey MI again.? While Lake Charlevoix was great, I for one would like to dive in Lake Michigan as well.? I could not believe how clear the water was in Lake Michigan off Charlevoix during PEX2022.
One other thought.? Lake Tahoe would be a great location for an expedition.? We have not been there since Innerspace Science.org expedition in 2018.? Key would be to finding someone in area to host. Not sure University of Davis would do it again without InnerspaceScience.org link.
Cliff
    On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 11:10:42 AM CST, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 I'd be down for one trip to?the keys and one to Bernie's! While ocean dives are obviously very attractive, we did have several boats (including mine) that were still in shakedown mode. For those, the logistics at a lake are way more forgiving.?
Alec
On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 11:49 AM Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

 I would like to see go back to Islamorada Florida for an expedition in 2023.? Maybe we could get the Suhr's to let us use their house as a staging area again.??
Cliff
    On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 08:08:34 AM CST, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 It's the time of year that we should start thinking about conventions and expeditions for 2023.? I'd like to see a bit more activity in this area and wonder if we should try to plan two events, a convention and an expedition.
Any feedback on locations, time of year?
Jon
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  _______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 13:04:32 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 18:04:32 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <CAHHFyEGOG-Ewy4b9wKK=54y05YRmpL+nxupsViPzwJD9xjzjcw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHHFyEGOG-Ewy4b9wKK=54y05YRmpL+nxupsViPzwJD9xjzjcw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <331490253.1019407.1668103472333@mail.yahoo.com>

 That's true Dave.? What's another 1500 miles when you're already halfway across the country.? ?:)
Jon



    On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 12:07:39 PM EST, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 I'm up for towing the Vast to Florida, not much farther than Michigan.
Best Regards,
David Colombo

804 College Ave
Santa Rosa, CA. 95404
(707) 536-1424
www.SeaQuestor.com




  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 13:08:42 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 18:08:42 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <CAODkcU8YaKr6fVVPUCq5ozc+QkgSuLBEK8oLWs_wto5+48gn_A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAODkcU8YaKr6fVVPUCq5ozc+QkgSuLBEK8oLWs_wto5+48gn_A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <638930088.1012092.1668103722200@mail.yahoo.com>

 Rick, yes...while it was a bit spotty last year we did broadcast the convention via Zoom.? I expect we will be continuing that at future meetings as long as we can get an internet connection where ever we are at the time.
Jon

    On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 10:14:49 AM EST, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 I vote Hawaii,,,Just kidding. no matter where it ends up Jon, is there a way that others that can't make it watch some or all of it via skype? I personally would like to get to know those in the group and put a face to a post.
Thanks?
Rick
On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 4:08 AM Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

It's the time of year that we should start thinking about conventions and expeditions for 2023.? I'd like to see a bit more activity in this area and wonder if we should try to plan two events, a convention and an expedition.
Any feedback on locations, time of year?
Jon
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 13:49:20 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 18:49:20 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <353682637.1010011.1668101782918@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CABECYQ7C1Dk--RwWG32gccj9vziHd2FRDaDEke71JEp-=erJxg@mail.gmail.com>
 <353682637.1010011.1668101782918@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1943945667.1049102.1668106160830@mail.yahoo.com>

 All good picks.
Michigan.? Bernie hasn't invited us back yet but that was probably the best infrastructure support we ever had.? I don't think we wanted for anything.? We would definitely need more surface support if we go anywhere off-shore.
Tahoe.? ?I really enjoyed this location as well and it had nice clear water.? Infrastructure was a little lacking however, Cliff I remember you traveling quite a distance to find a dive shop to fill tanks and I also recall getting into the water at some locations was a bit expensive.? Lacking a sponsor like the University I think we would have to investigate renting a "compound" that has enough land and utilities to support refreshing the subs every night.
Islamorada.? An ocean experience would be nice again.? Without the Suhr's property, launchings would be more difficult and we'd either have to use public launches or commercial boat yard.? Tows would be required to get any place interesting to dive.? Plenty of infrastructure otherwise.
Jon
??
    On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 12:38:18 PM EST, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
  I would be up for towing the R300 to either Islamorada Fl or Petoskey MI again.? While Lake Charlevoix was great, I for one would like to dive in Lake Michigan as well.? I could not believe how clear the water was in Lake Michigan off Charlevoix during PEX2022.
One other thought.? Lake Tahoe would be a great location for an expedition.? We have not been there since Innerspace Science.org expedition in 2018.? Key would be to finding someone in area to host. Not sure University of Davis would do it again without InnerspaceScience.org link.
Cliff
    On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 11:10:42 AM CST, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 I'd be down for one trip to?the keys and one to Bernie's! While ocean dives are obviously very attractive, we did have several boats (including mine) that were still in shakedown mode. For those, the logistics at a lake are way more forgiving.?
Alec
On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 11:49 AM Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

 I would like to see go back to Islamorada Florida for an expedition in 2023.? Maybe we could get the Suhr's to let us use their house as a staging area again.??
Cliff
   

  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 15:53:41 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Bob Travis via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 12:53:41 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <1943945667.1049102.1668106160830@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CABECYQ7C1Dk--RwWG32gccj9vziHd2FRDaDEke71JEp-=erJxg@mail.gmail.com>
 <353682637.1010011.1668101782918@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1943945667.1049102.1668106160830@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <224228258.370575.1668113621299@connect.xfinity.com>

I would love to attend this next year. I could make Tahoe or most likely Michigan. I don't think I could make Florida (I'm in Washington State). 

Bob

>     On 11/10/2022 10:49 AM Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
>     All good picks.
> 
>     Michigan.  Bernie hasn't invited us back yet but that was probably the best infrastructure support we ever had.  I don't think we wanted for anything.  We would definitely need more surface support if we go anywhere off-shore.
> 
>     Tahoe.   I really enjoyed this location as well and it had nice clear water.  Infrastructure was a little lacking however, Cliff I remember you traveling quite a distance to find a dive shop to fill tanks and I also recall getting into the water at some locations was a bit expensive.  Lacking a sponsor like the University I think we would have to investigate renting a "compound" that has enough land and utilities to support refreshing the subs every night.
> 
>     Islamorada.  An ocean experience would be nice again.  Without the Suhr's property, launchings would be more difficult and we'd either have to use public launches or commercial boat yard.  Tows would be required to get any place interesting to dive.  Plenty of infrastructure otherwise.
> 
>     Jon
> 
>       
> 
>     On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 12:38:18 PM EST, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
>     I would be up for towing the R300 to either Islamorada Fl or Petoskey MI again.  While Lake Charlevoix was great, I for one would like to dive in Lake Michigan as well.  I could not believe how clear the water was in Lake Michigan off Charlevoix during PEX2022.
> 
>     One other thought.  Lake Tahoe would be a great location for an expedition.  We have not been there since Innerspace Science.org expedition in 2018.  Key would be to finding someone in area to host. Not sure University of Davis would do it again without InnerspaceScience.org link.
> 
>     Cliff
> 
>     On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 11:10:42 AM CST, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
>     I'd be down for one trip to the keys and one to Bernie's! While ocean dives are obviously very attractive, we did have several boats (including mine) that were still in shakedown mode. For those, the logistics at a lake are way more forgiving. 
> 
>     Alec
> 
>     On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 11:49 AM Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org > wrote:
> 
>         > > 
> >         I would like to see go back to Islamorada Florida for an expedition in 2023.  Maybe we could get the Suhr's to let us use their house as a staging area again.  
> > 
> >         Cliff
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >     >     _______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 16:22:18 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 13:22:18 -0800
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 107, Issue 4
In-Reply-To: <mailman.806.1654658746.870.personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
References: <mailman.806.1654658746.870.personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Message-ID: <CAGL1GvFnTnPAQn=uUNzywja8WsSPjEBLRhV17HyZHZyxgxW+Jg@mail.gmail.com>

Jon,
Have you considered two smaller banks of 50ah batteries spread across both
pods? Unfortunately, the popular 12v 100ah LiFePO4 batteries on the market
are all just a little to big to fit in the kittredge pods.

I'm with you. From a maintenance point of view alone, LiFePO4 is the way to
go.

River J Dolfi
Rdolfi7 at gmail.com
412-997-2526

On Tue, Jun 7, 2022, 20:26 via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to
>         personal_submersibles at psubs.org
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> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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> than "Re: Contents of Personal_Submersibles digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 107, Issue 2
>       (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 8 Jun 2022 03:25:28 +0000 (UTC)
> From: Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: "personal_submersibles at psubs.org"
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>,
>         "personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org"
>         <personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 107,
>         Issue 2
> Message-ID: <1467532091.766897.1654658728231 at mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
>  Hugh, how big are the files?? Can you email them to me?
> >From what I've seen and heard with others experience, I feel 50ah per
> trolling motor is plenty.? I'm using 36v 101# minnkota's and would like to
> use a 36v 100ah battery that could power two motors.? Length is not an
> issue but the diameter of the pods limits the width cross-section.? I'll
> have to measure again to get the exact size but it's about 8.75 inches.
> Rebel sells a 36v-100ah LiFePO4 for $1595 (US) but won't fit in my battery
> pods.? I might be able to get it to fit inside the sub though.
> Jon
>
>
>     On Monday, June 6, 2022, 06:18:07 PM EDT, via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>  Hi Jon, Hank, et co.
>
> I have been repackaging LiFePO4 for 10 years now since I started.
> This is the main thing that has kept me from getting my sub in the water.
>
> First thing you need to decide on is the Life PO4 type.? Either cylindrical
> or Prismatic.? Cylindrical batteries have better performance.? I am using
> 15
> Ah cells (headway 40152S 15Ah )which have a 10C discharge i.e. 150 amps.?
> We
> have made a test circuit where we discharge them at 150 amps and see what
> the current drops to in each cell.? I have 560 cells.? The problem with
> them
> is that you need multiple CMU (cell management Units) to balance them and
> then report via CAN to the BMS.? These cells are 40mm diam x mounted in
> hexagonal plastic interlocking mounts and you can build different shapes.?
> I
> have a number of different strings of 8 cells (24v) in parallel and series.
> The idea of these is to have an air space around each cell and to provide
> good cooling.
>
> Due to the pain in my butt from having all these CMU's to deal with I am
> now
> changing over to Prismatic which are rectangular.? The ones I am using are
> 120Ah and I am able to get 1.5 times the total energy for the sub.? i.e.
> 32kwh instead of 22 kwh.? Now I am able to use far fewer CMU's and simplify
> the system and packaging but only able to get 2C discharge (240 amps per
> cell).? These cells are a lot cheaper and easier to manage and
> package/service etc..
>
> The problem with sub batteries is the length of time between uses and
> keeping the system charged.
>
> This is a lengthy subject and I have a fair bit of experience in problems
> that I have had.?
> I suggest you put together the wish list you have and the operating voltage
> and total amphours you are wanting to achieve.
>
> I would not recommend removing the BMS and CMU's from the packs.
>
> Jon if you can tell me where I can drop a bunch of documents I am sure I
> can
> assist with my experience in these.? I have had some cells let go and
> others
> punctured.? Both types.
>
> I am also importing electric vehicles with lead acid and going to convert
> to
> LiFePo4.
>
> Cheers to all,
> Hugh
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org> On
> Behalf Of via Personal_Submersibles
> Sent: Tuesday, 7 June 2022 7:50 AM
> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
> Subject: Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 107, Issue 2
>
> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to
> ??? personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> ??? http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> ??? personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> ??? personal_submersibles-owner at psubs.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than
> "Re: Contents of Personal_Submersibles digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> ? 1. Re: Repackaged LifePo4? (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles)
> ? 2. Re: Repackaged LifePo4? (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
> ? 3. Re: Repackaged LifePo4? (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2022 11:27:39 +0000 (UTC)
> From: Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles
> ??? <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> ??? <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Repackaged LifePo4?
> Message-ID: <1768746693.7700625.1654514859732 at mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
>  I agree, buoyancy is a factor but can be addressed by filling the battery
> pods with lead or concrete weight in replacement of the original battery
> weight.? I believe I can literally power the entire submarine with just two
> LiFePo4 batteries if I wanted to.? That's attractive to me in terms of
> maintenance.
> Jon
>
> ? ? On Monday, June 6, 2022, 07:06:11 AM EDT, Rick Patton via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:?
>
>  The one thing that comes to mind Jon is that the Ksubs buoyancy is
> designed
> using the wet cell batteries which may not be an issue but worth
> considering.?Batteries have come so far since the Captain designed his
> three
> models and I have wanted to upgrade to a more efficient battery myself but
> have decided to stick with what?s on the plans due to space limitations and
> possible weight differences.?Rick ?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jun 6, 2022, at 6:34 AM, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> ?Looking for some brain-power deductive reasoning.? I've been following
> some
> of these youtube channels that teardown LiFePo4 batteries to see what's
> inside and also test various functions of them.? I've notice with all of
> them that the actual Lifepo packs are significantly smaller than the
> container they are inserted into and use padding keep them centered.? At
> first I assumed this was to prevent chafing of the cells against the
> container but also noticed that padding is not used on the bottom which
> seems to me where most movement that might cause chafing would occur.? So
> I'm left to assume manufactures are simply using padding so they can
> provide
> LifePo batteries in industry standard battery group sizes.
> Given that the battery pods on K-Subs do not lend themselves well to
> current
> battery groups I'm curious what you guys think about repackaging current
> market LifePO batteries into smaller containers.? I can't see any reason
> not
> to do it but am sure there are some opinions out there I would want to
> hear.
> Jon
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________
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> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2022 08:25:20 -0600
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
> ??? <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> ??? <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Repackaged LifePo4?
> Message-ID: <E937B7EF-67DE-429B-9F2A-92E5AC3A33A4 at yahoo.ca>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Jon, I had the same idea and cut the top off one of my batteries. In my
> case
> there is little space saving height wise but there could be savings on the
> width.? The BMS sits on top of the cells.? There is no significant padding
> under the cells.? If you are willing to remove the BMS board, you could
> reduce the heigh by about 2 inches.? This would be very doable if you built
> a cage.
> Hank
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Jun 6, 2022, at 5:28 AM, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >
> > ?
> > I agree, buoyancy is a factor but can be addressed by filling the battery
> pods with lead or concrete weight in replacement of the original battery
> weight.? I believe I can literally power the entire submarine with just two
> LiFePo4 batteries if I wanted to.? That's attractive to me in terms of
> maintenance.
> >
> > Jon
> >
> >
> >> On Monday, June 6, 2022, 07:06:11 AM EDT, Rick Patton via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> The one thing that comes to mind Jon is that the Ksubs buoyancy is
> designed using the wet cell batteries which may not be an issue but worth
> considering.
> >> Batteries have come so far since the Captain designed his three models
> and I have wanted to upgrade to a more efficient battery myself but have
> decided to stick with what?s on the plans due to space limitations and
> possible weight differences.
> >> Rick
> >>
> >> Sent from my iPhone
> >>
> >>> On Jun 6, 2022, at 6:34 AM, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >> ?
> >> Looking for some brain-power deductive reasoning.? I've been following
> some of these youtube channels that teardown LiFePo4 batteries to see
> what's
> inside and also test various functions of them.? I've notice with all of
> them that the actual Lifepo packs are significantly smaller than the
> container they are inserted into and use padding keep them centered.? At
> first I assumed this was to prevent chafing of the cells against the
> container but also noticed that padding is not used on the bottom which
> seems to me where most movement that might cause chafing would occur.? So
> I'm left to assume manufactures are simply using padding so they can
> provide
> LifePo batteries in industry standard battery group sizes.
> >>
> >> Given that the battery pods on K-Subs do not lend themselves well to
> current battery groups I'm curious what you guys think about repackaging
> current market LifePO batteries into smaller containers.? I can't see any
> reason not to do it but am sure there are some opinions out there I would
> want to hear.
> >>
> >> Jon
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 6 Jun 2022 12:49:46 -0700
> From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles
> ??? <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> ??? <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Repackaged LifePo4?
> Message-ID:
> ??? <CAHHFyEGjyRy2TnWcQHLWWH8xnJsrC2z+ciy1Y=VeNY-PqvG7LA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hi Jon, I am currently using a single battery in the VAST interior AGM,
> weight of 58 lbs, dim 13.3x6.875x8.5" tall, 92 AH. My replacement lipo4 is
> 43.1 lbs, dim 19.02x6.7x9.45" tall, and 200AH.
> This battery I will be laying on its side which gives me an additional 2
> inches of vertical height, which will give me better access to the scrubber
> location.The loss of weight of 14.3 lbs will be cast as a lead weight and
> placed in my drop weight tray. Better center of gravity and less weight in
> the aft section.
> I have played with the idea of having the cells placed as an arc between
> the
> internal t ribs as an alternative by building my own lipo4 battery pack. It
> would certainly give back valuable? space in the VAST with such a design,
> just not sure I have the bandwidth to add another design project to my
> current schedule, but you never know.
> My thoughts on the battery pods, are to use the lipo4 as they come, figure
> out how to add lead weights in the hollow area beneath the batteries for
> some cast lead strips. At a cost $500 per battery or more depending on the
> AH desired, I wouldn't cut them open. Might be cheaper to build your own.
> David
>
> On Mon, Jun 6, 2022, 7:26 AM hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> > Jon, I had the same idea and cut the top off one of my batteries. In
> > my case there is little space saving height wise but there could be
> savings on
> > the width.? The BMS sits on top of the cells.? There is no significant
> > padding under the cells.? If you are willing to remove the BMS board,
> > you could reduce the heigh by about 2 inches.? This would be very
> > doable if you built a cage.
> > Hank
> >
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > On Jun 6, 2022, at 5:28 AM, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <
> > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >
> > ?
> > I agree, buoyancy is a factor but can be addressed by filling the
> > battery pods with lead or concrete weight in replacement of the
> > original battery weight.? I believe I can literally power the entire
> > submarine with just two
> > LiFePo4 batteries if I wanted to.? That's attractive to me in terms of
> > maintenance.
> >
> > Jon
> >
> >
> > On Monday, June 6, 2022, 07:06:11 AM EDT, Rick Patton via
> > Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >
> >
> > The one thing that comes to mind Jon is that the Ksubs buoyancy is
> > designed using the wet cell batteries which may not be an issue but
> > worth considering.
> > Batteries have come so far since the Captain designed his three models
> > and I have wanted to upgrade to a more efficient battery myself but
> > have decided to stick with what?s on the plans due to space
> > limitations and possible weight differences.
> > Rick
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> > On Jun 6, 2022, at 6:34 AM, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <
> > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >
> > ?
> > Looking for some brain-power deductive reasoning.? I've been following
> > some of these youtube channels that teardown LiFePo4 batteries to see
> > what's inside and also test various functions of them.? I've notice
> > with all of them that the actual Lifepo packs are significantly
> > smaller than the container they are inserted into and use padding keep
> > them centered.? At first I assumed this was to prevent chafing of the
> > cells against the container but also noticed that padding is not used
> > on the bottom which seems to me where most movement that might cause
> > chafing would occur.? So I'm left to assume manufactures are simply
> > using padding so they can provide LifePo batteries in industry standard
> battery group sizes.
> >
> > Given that the battery pods on K-Subs do not lend themselves well to
> > current battery groups I'm curious what you guys think about
> > repackaging current market LifePO batteries into smaller containers.?
> > I can't see any reason not to do it but am sure there are some
> > opinions out there I would want to hear.
> >
> > Jon
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 21:13:31 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 18:13:31 -0800
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <224228258.370575.1668113621299@connect.xfinity.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CABECYQ7C1Dk--RwWG32gccj9vziHd2FRDaDEke71JEp-=erJxg@mail.gmail.com>
 <353682637.1010011.1668101782918@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1943945667.1049102.1668106160830@mail.yahoo.com>
 <224228258.370575.1668113621299@connect.xfinity.com>
Message-ID: <CAHHFyEGAEiAM6=zyxg56q05FGaCPnc_s_RtPw8SHJ36URjWLAw@mail.gmail.com>

If Michigan is on the list, I would definitely want to explore the mackinaw
area which has a huge number of wrecks. The need for dedicated support tows
and or barges would be best, as well as number of support divers would be
needed.  I know that Bernie and I still need to do some deep water
shakedowns before that. If our typical winter holds here in California, I
will be doing that in December / January for the Vast. Bernie will have to
wait till the ice melts. Tahoe could be a great area if we can find a
dedicated property rental with its own dock and ramp. The park at Sand
Harbour was capable of handling the subs, but the downside is having to go
to Carson City for HP air and or dive supplies which is a pain. Currently
the Tahoe Dive Center at stateline is closed for the season, scheduled to
reopen in April of 23. They can do hp fills by appointment only in the off
season.

Best Regards,
David Colombo

804 College Ave
Santa Rosa, CA. 95404
(707) 536-1424
www.SeaQuestor.com



On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 12:55 PM Bob Travis via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> I would love to attend this next year. I could make Tahoe or most likely
> Michigan. I don't think I could make Florida (I'm in Washington State).
>
> Bob
>
> On 11/10/2022 10:49 AM Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> All good picks.
>
> Michigan.  Bernie hasn't invited us back yet but that was probably the
> best infrastructure support we ever had.  I don't think we wanted for
> anything.  We would definitely need more surface support if we go anywhere
> off-shore.
>
> Tahoe.   I really enjoyed this location as well and it had nice clear
> water.  Infrastructure was a little lacking however, Cliff I remember you
> traveling quite a distance to find a dive shop to fill tanks and I also
> recall getting into the water at some locations was a bit expensive.
> Lacking a sponsor like the University I think we would have to investigate
> renting a "compound" that has enough land and utilities to support
> refreshing the subs every night.
>
> Islamorada.  An ocean experience would be nice again.  Without the Suhr's
> property, launchings would be more difficult and we'd either have to use
> public launches or commercial boat yard.  Tows would be required to get any
> place interesting to dive.  Plenty of infrastructure otherwise.
>
> Jon
>
>
>
> On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 12:38:18 PM EST, Cliff Redus via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> I would be up for towing the R300 to either Islamorada Fl or Petoskey MI
> again.  While Lake Charlevoix was great, I for one would like to dive in
> Lake Michigan as well.  I could not believe how clear the water was in Lake
> Michigan off Charlevoix during PEX2022.
>
> One other thought.  Lake Tahoe would be a great location for an
> expedition.  We have not been there since Innerspace Science.org expedition
> in 2018.  Key would be to finding someone in area to host. Not sure
> University of Davis would do it again without InnerspaceScience.org link.
>
> Cliff
>
> On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 11:10:42 AM CST, Alec Smyth via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> I'd be down for one trip to the keys and one to Bernie's! While ocean
> dives are obviously very attractive, we did have several boats (including
> mine) that were still in shakedown mode. For those, the logistics at a lake
> are way more forgiving.
>
> Alec
>
> On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 11:49 AM Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> I would like to see go back to Islamorada Florida for an expedition in
> 2023.  Maybe we could get the Suhr's to let us use their house as a staging
> area again.
>
> Cliff
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 10 21:28:38 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2022 18:28:38 -0800
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PC2023
In-Reply-To: <CAHHFyEGAEiAM6=zyxg56q05FGaCPnc_s_RtPw8SHJ36URjWLAw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <283008098.862154.1668089242047.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <283008098.862154.1668089242047@mail.yahoo.com>
 <571485112.963337.1668098881778@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CABECYQ7C1Dk--RwWG32gccj9vziHd2FRDaDEke71JEp-=erJxg@mail.gmail.com>
 <353682637.1010011.1668101782918@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1943945667.1049102.1668106160830@mail.yahoo.com>
 <224228258.370575.1668113621299@connect.xfinity.com>
 <CAHHFyEGAEiAM6=zyxg56q05FGaCPnc_s_RtPw8SHJ36URjWLAw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAHHFyEE1kP=N=UWAMCkoZW1skY=BcAyi0+AUaMsA9ZNz3ew=RQ@mail.gmail.com>

Jon, For Tahoe one thought might be to team up with the Clean the lake
group and dive the deeper areas as reconnocince for their clean up efforts.
Imagine subs out scouting for Trash in Tahoe. Here is their latest news
letter.
https://files.constantcontact.com/ebad0e92801/4c68a369-825e-424d-8866-eec634761482.pdf
since they use divers, air might not be a problem.

Best Regards,
David Colombo

804 College Ave
Santa Rosa, CA. 95404
(707) 536-1424
www.SeaQuestor.com



On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 6:13 PM David Colombo <seaquestor at gmail.com> wrote:

> If Michigan is on the list, I would definitely want to explore the
> mackinaw area which has a huge number of wrecks. The need for dedicated
> support tows and or barges would be best, as well as number of support
> divers would be needed.  I know that Bernie and I still need to do some
> deep water shakedowns before that. If our typical winter holds here in
> California, I will be doing that in December / January for the Vast. Bernie
> will have to wait till the ice melts. Tahoe could be a great area if we can
> find a dedicated property rental with its own dock and ramp. The park at
> Sand Harbour was capable of handling the subs, but the downside is having
> to go to Carson City for HP air and or dive supplies which is a pain.
> Currently the Tahoe Dive Center at stateline is closed for the season,
> scheduled to reopen in April of 23. They can do hp fills by appointment
> only in the off season.
>
> Best Regards,
> David Colombo
>
> 804 College Ave
> Santa Rosa, CA. 95404
> (707) 536-1424
> www.SeaQuestor.com
>
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 12:55 PM Bob Travis via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>> I would love to attend this next year. I could make Tahoe or most likely
>> Michigan. I don't think I could make Florida (I'm in Washington State).
>>
>> Bob
>>
>> On 11/10/2022 10:49 AM Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> All good picks.
>>
>> Michigan.  Bernie hasn't invited us back yet but that was probably the
>> best infrastructure support we ever had.  I don't think we wanted for
>> anything.  We would definitely need more surface support if we go anywhere
>> off-shore.
>>
>> Tahoe.   I really enjoyed this location as well and it had nice clear
>> water.  Infrastructure was a little lacking however, Cliff I remember you
>> traveling quite a distance to find a dive shop to fill tanks and I also
>> recall getting into the water at some locations was a bit expensive.
>> Lacking a sponsor like the University I think we would have to investigate
>> renting a "compound" that has enough land and utilities to support
>> refreshing the subs every night.
>>
>> Islamorada.  An ocean experience would be nice again.  Without the Suhr's
>> property, launchings would be more difficult and we'd either have to use
>> public launches or commercial boat yard.  Tows would be required to get any
>> place interesting to dive.  Plenty of infrastructure otherwise.
>>
>> Jon
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 12:38:18 PM EST, Cliff Redus via
>> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> I would be up for towing the R300 to either Islamorada Fl or Petoskey MI
>> again.  While Lake Charlevoix was great, I for one would like to dive in
>> Lake Michigan as well.  I could not believe how clear the water was in Lake
>> Michigan off Charlevoix during PEX2022.
>>
>> One other thought.  Lake Tahoe would be a great location for an
>> expedition.  We have not been there since Innerspace Science.org expedition
>> in 2018.  Key would be to finding someone in area to host. Not sure
>> University of Davis would do it again without InnerspaceScience.org link.
>>
>> Cliff
>>
>> On Thursday, November 10, 2022 at 11:10:42 AM CST, Alec Smyth via
>> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I'd be down for one trip to the keys and one to Bernie's! While ocean
>> dives are obviously very attractive, we did have several boats (including
>> mine) that were still in shakedown mode. For those, the logistics at a lake
>> are way more forgiving.
>>
>> Alec
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 10, 2022 at 11:49 AM Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I would like to see go back to Islamorada Florida for an expedition in
>> 2023.  Maybe we could get the Suhr's to let us use their house as a staging
>> area again.
>>
>> Cliff
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Nov 13 10:44:36 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2022 08:44:36 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
References: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494.ref@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>

Hi submarine friends.  I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.  The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.  An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.  My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.  
  Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port  from zero to operating depth in my chamber?  
Hank
Sent from my iPhone


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Nov 13 17:54:44 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2022 22:54:44 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
References: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494.ref@yahoo.ca>
 <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <1059950058.2208402.1668380084922@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi Hank,You would need an electronic pressure gauge for feedback to a computer (Arduino) & a display for visually monitoring what was going on.?The Arduino turns the hydraulic pump on via a solenoid switch; when you get to the required pressure the program
turns the pump off & perhaps you could have a nipple with a small orifice that releases the oil back in to the sump via a tube, dropping the pressure in the process. The oil would be coming out of this nipple while you are pressurizing, but it's just a simple solution for the depressurizing faze.Once the pressure drops to a set level the program cycles again. The Arduino counts each cycle and stops at the end. The display shows pressure and cycle number.You would possibly need to adjust the program depending on how it operated & maybe have pwm control over the motor speed if it pressurized too fast.BTW I had some SS electronic pressure gauges made up with threads compatible with 1st stage regulator ports.I just finished a project for counting the anchor length on a boat, so a little bit familiar with what's needed on the computer side.The project below uses an Arduino Nano & a cheap 16 x 2 display. Probably around $25- of components there.Alan



Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Mon, 14 Nov 2022 at 4:46 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:   Hi submarine friends.? I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.? The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.? An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.? My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.? 
? Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port? from zero to operating depth in my chamber?? 
Hank
Sent from my iPhone

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Nov 13 18:56:54 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2022 23:56:54 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <1059950058.2208402.1668380084922@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494.ref@yahoo.ca>
 <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
 <1059950058.2208402.1668380084922@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1156513073.2223729.1668383815061@mail.yahoo.com>

 Alan describes a pretty reliable system.? The pressure sensor might be the most expensive part.? If you can find a solenoid valve for the pressure you are expecting then the computer could activate that as well instead of relying on an open orifice to release the pressure.? Teensy 4.0 would be an alternative for the nano.? An Rpi would be better because it's easy to log the results but they are very difficult to find these days because of the chip shortage.? I can help with the programming as well.
Jon

    On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 06:00:53 PM EST, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 Hi Hank,You would need an electronic pressure gauge for feedback to a computer (Arduino) & a display for visually monitoring what was going on.?The Arduino turns the hydraulic pump on via a solenoid switch; when you get to the required pressure the program
turns the pump off & perhaps you could have a nipple with a small orifice that releases the oil back in to the sump via a tube, dropping the pressure in the process. The oil would be coming out of this nipple while you are pressurizing, but it's just a simple solution for the depressurizing faze.Once the pressure drops to a set level the program cycles again. The Arduino counts each cycle and stops at the end. The display shows pressure and cycle number.You would possibly need to adjust the program depending on how it operated & maybe have pwm control over the motor speed if it pressurized too fast.BTW I had some SS electronic pressure gauges made up with threads compatible with 1st stage regulator ports.I just finished a project for counting the anchor length on a boat, so a little bit familiar with what's needed on the computer side.The project below uses an Arduino Nano & a cheap 16 x 2 display. Probably around $25- of components there.Alan



Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Mon, 14 Nov 2022 at 4:46 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:   Hi submarine friends.? I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.? The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.? An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.? My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.? 
? Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port? from zero to operating depth in my chamber?? 
Hank
Sent from my iPhone

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Nov 13 20:21:17 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2022 20:21:17 -0500
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <1156513073.2223729.1668383815061@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1156513073.2223729.1668383815061@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <73D24649-BA48-44A6-969D-191F154CD674@gmail.com>

Hank, I think I?ve got some pressure sensors lying around in an old box. I?ll gladly mail one to you if you want to go this route. Seems like a really necessary test to me, just because of it being a new material. BTW congrats on the destructive test, that?s really promising!

Alec

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 13, 2022, at 6:59 PM, Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Alan describes a pretty reliable system.  The pressure sensor might be the most expensive part.  If you can find a solenoid valve for the pressure you are expecting then the computer could activate that as well instead of relying on an open orifice to release the pressure.  Teensy 4.0 would be an alternative for the nano.  An Rpi would be better because it's easy to log the results but they are very difficult to find these days because of the chip shortage.  I can help with the programming as well.
> 
> Jon
> 
> 
> On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 06:00:53 PM EST, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Hank,
> You would need an electronic pressure gauge for feedback to a computer (Arduino) & a display for visually monitoring what was going on. 
> The Arduino turns the hydraulic pump on via a solenoid switch; when you get to the required pressure the program
> turns the pump off & perhaps you could have a nipple with a small orifice that releases the oil back in to the sump via a tube, dropping the pressure in the process. The oil would be coming out of this nipple while you are pressurizing, but it's just a simple solution for the depressurizing faze.
> Once the pressure drops to a set level the program cycles again. The Arduino counts each cycle and stops at the end. The display shows pressure and cycle number.
> You would possibly need to adjust the program depending on how it operated & maybe have pwm control over the motor speed if it pressurized too fast.
> BTW I had some SS electronic pressure gauges made up with threads compatible with 1st stage regulator ports.
> I just finished a project for counting the anchor length on a boat, so a little bit familiar with what's needed on the computer side.
> The project below uses an Arduino Nano & a cheap 16 x 2 display. Probably around $25- of components there.
> Alan
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android
> 
> On Mon, 14 Nov 2022 at 4:46 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> Hi submarine friends.  I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.  The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.  An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.  My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.  
>   Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port  from zero to operating depth in my chamber?  
> Hank
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Nov 13 22:33:14 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2022 03:33:14 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
References: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494.ref@yahoo.ca>
 <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <1400997123.2288746.1668396794349@mail.yahoo.com>

 Hank,
I would use a direct acting cartridge style proportional pressures reducing valve, something like a Hydraforce?EHPR08-33X?Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33.? These are installed in a small aluminum manifold in which you connect hydraulic tubing with Swagelok fittings.? These valves let you specify a control signal, usually 4-20mA.? They then can be used to automatically hold the pressure and any level between zero and the maximum your pressure supply can make.? You then use a small inexpensive PLC like the Automation Direct Click PLC?CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect?along with pressure transducer and an inexpensive small touch screen display.? ?Again, you can get these from Automationdirect. You would also need to install in the PLC an analog current output that will would be connected to the proportional pressure regulator. You then program the PLC with your laptop with some simple ladder logic that sends the control current to the proportional pressure regulator to step through the pressures you want the test chamber to see over time.? Most of these small PLC's have data logging capability so you can log test chamber pressure as a function of time.? If you also installed a contactor on the power to the pressure supply, the PLC could be programed to shut down the system if the viewport failed based on the measured test chamber pressure dropping to zero.??

| 
| 
|  | 
CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect

Save on CLICK Series Programmable Logic Controllers at AutomationDirect, your source for Click PLCs at low price...
 |

 |

 |




These proportional pressures reducing valve could also be run with a microprocessor?like Jon uses and setup in a similar way.
Best?

| 
| 
|  | 
Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33

PROPORTIONAL PRESSURE REDUCING / RELIEVING CARTRIDGE VALVE
 |

 |

 |

.??



    On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 09:45:39 AM CST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 Hi submarine friends.? I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.? The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.? An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.? My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.? 
? Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port? from zero to operating depth in my chamber?? 
Hank
Sent from my iPhone

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 08:06:29 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 06:06:29 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <1400997123.2288746.1668396794349@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1400997123.2288746.1668396794349@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>

Hi guys, thanks for the input.  I will take it as a compliment that you think I can manage these electronic solutions.   
I will opt for a more simple system.  I ordered a compressor pressure switch.  I will modify the low pressure setting.   The switch will activate a small solenoid to fill the chamber to 175 psi.  The chamber will have a bleed valve that is constantly bleeding very slowly.  Once the pressure drops to near zero, the switch will tell the solenoid to fill the chamber again.  We can time the cycle, and walk away for a month.  
Hank

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 13, 2022, at 8:33 PM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Hank,
> 
> I would use a direct acting cartridge style proportional pressures reducing valve, something like a Hydraforce EHPR08-33X Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33.  These are installed in a small aluminum manifold in which you connect hydraulic tubing with Swagelok fittings.  These valves let you specify a control signal, usually 4-20mA.  They then can be used to automatically hold the pressure and any level between zero and the maximum your pressure supply can make.  You then use a small inexpensive PLC like the Automation Direct Click PLC CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect along with pressure transducer and an inexpensive small touch screen display.   Again, you can get these from Automationdirect. You would also need to install in the PLC an analog current output that will would be connected to the proportional pressure regulator. You then program the PLC with your laptop with some simple ladder logic that sends the control current to the proportional pressure regulator to step through the pressures you want the test chamber to see over time.  Most of these small PLC's have data logging capability so you can log test chamber pressure as a function of time.  If you also installed a contactor on the power to the pressure supply, the PLC could be programed to shut down the system if the viewport failed based on the measured test chamber pressure dropping to zero.  
> 
> CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect
> Save on CLICK Series Programmable Logic Controllers at AutomationDirect, your source for Click PLCs at low price...
> 
> 
> 
> These proportional pressures reducing valve could also be run with a microprocessor like Jon uses and setup in a similar way.
> 
> Best 
> 
> Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33
> PROPORTIONAL PRESSURE REDUCING / RELIEVING CARTRIDGE VALVE
> .  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 09:45:39 AM CST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi submarine friends.  I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.  The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.  An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.  My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.  
>   Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port  from zero to operating depth in my chamber?  
> Hank
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 09:22:27 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 09:22:27 -0500
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>
References: <1400997123.2288746.1668396794349@mail.yahoo.com>
 <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <CABECYQ5bK0VnippzJabUw+Pnb0ESWM+JY=kQpUj3aGOKyCjHjg@mail.gmail.com>

Hah, I *knew* you'd come up with something like that! It's funny how each
person here is either an Arduino person, a PLC person, etc. They all work.

Alec

On Tue, Nov 15, 2022 at 8:07 AM hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hi guys, thanks for the input.  I will take it as a compliment that you
> think I can manage these electronic solutions.
> I will opt for a more simple system.  I ordered a compressor pressure
> switch.  I will modify the low pressure setting.   The switch will activate
> a small solenoid to fill the chamber to 175 psi.  The chamber will have a
> bleed valve that is constantly bleeding very slowly.  Once the pressure
> drops to near zero, the switch will tell the solenoid to fill the chamber
> again.  We can time the cycle, and walk away for a month.
> Hank
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Nov 13, 2022, at 8:33 PM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> ?
> Hank,
>
> I would use a direct acting cartridge style proportional pressures
> reducing valve, something like a Hydraforce EHPR08-33X Hydraforce |
> Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33
> <https://www.hydraforce.com/products/valves/electro-proportional-controls/ehpr08-33/>.
> These are installed in a small aluminum manifold in which you connect
> hydraulic tubing with Swagelok fittings.  These valves let you specify a
> control signal, usually 4-20mA.  They then can be used to automatically
> hold the pressure and any level between zero and the maximum your pressure
> supply can make.  You then use a small inexpensive PLC like the Automation
> Direct Click PLC CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect
> <https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/overview/catalog/programmable_controllers/click_plcs_(stackable_micro_brick)> along
> with pressure transducer and an inexpensive small touch screen display.
>  Again, you can get these from Automationdirect. You would also need to
> install in the PLC an analog current output that will would be connected to
> the proportional pressure regulator. You then program the PLC with your
> laptop with some simple ladder logic that sends the control current to the
> proportional pressure regulator to step through the pressures you want the
> test chamber to see over time.  Most of these small PLC's have data logging
> capability so you can log test chamber pressure as a function of time.  If
> you also installed a contactor on the power to the pressure supply, the PLC
> could be programed to shut down the system if the viewport failed based on
> the measured test chamber pressure dropping to zero.
>
> CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect
>
> Save on CLICK Series Programmable Logic Controllers at AutomationDirect,
> your source for Click PLCs at low price...
>
> <https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/overview/catalog/programmable_controllers/click_plcs_(stackable_micro_brick)>
>
>
>
> These proportional pressures reducing valve could also be run with a
> microprocessor like Jon uses and setup in a similar way.
>
> Best
>
> Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33
>
> PROPORTIONAL PRESSURE REDUCING / RELIEVING CARTRIDGE VALVE
>
> <https://www.hydraforce.com/products/valves/electro-proportional-controls/ehpr08-33/>
> .
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 09:45:39 AM CST, hank pronk via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Hi submarine friends.  I just completed a pressure test to failure on our
> Cast Epoxy port.  The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.  An acrylic port this
> size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.  My Epoxy port failed at
> 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.
>   Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port  from
> zero to operating depth in my chamber?
> Hank
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 10:50:06 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 08:50:06 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <CABECYQ5bK0VnippzJabUw+Pnb0ESWM+JY=kQpUj3aGOKyCjHjg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CABECYQ5bK0VnippzJabUw+Pnb0ESWM+JY=kQpUj3aGOKyCjHjg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8F1814B0-FDCD-45E5-8DF5-1BB29A650B7C@yahoo.ca>

Alec, yes it takes a community to do what we do. Look how far we have come collectively.   
Hank

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 15, 2022, at 7:22 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Hah, I *knew* you'd come up with something like that! It's funny how each person here is either an Arduino person, a PLC person, etc. They all work.
> 
> Alec
> 
>> On Tue, Nov 15, 2022 at 8:07 AM hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Hi guys, thanks for the input.  I will take it as a compliment that you think I can manage these electronic solutions.   
>> I will opt for a more simple system.  I ordered a compressor pressure switch.  I will modify the low pressure setting.   The switch will activate a small solenoid to fill the chamber to 175 psi.  The chamber will have a bleed valve that is constantly bleeding very slowly.  Once the pressure drops to near zero, the switch will tell the solenoid to fill the chamber again.  We can time the cycle, and walk away for a month.  
>> Hank
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>>> On Nov 13, 2022, at 8:33 PM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>> ?
>>> Hank,
>>> 
>>> I would use a direct acting cartridge style proportional pressures reducing valve, something like a Hydraforce EHPR08-33X Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33.  These are installed in a small aluminum manifold in which you connect hydraulic tubing with Swagelok fittings.  These valves let you specify a control signal, usually 4-20mA.  They then can be used to automatically hold the pressure and any level between zero and the maximum your pressure supply can make.  You then use a small inexpensive PLC like the Automation Direct Click PLC CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect along with pressure transducer and an inexpensive small touch screen display.   Again, you can get these from Automationdirect. You would also need to install in the PLC an analog current output that will would be connected to the proportional pressure regulator. You then program the PLC with your laptop with some simple ladder logic that sends the control current to the proportional pressure regulator to step through the pressures you want the test chamber to see over time.  Most of these small PLC's have data logging capability so you can log test chamber pressure as a function of time.  If you also installed a contactor on the power to the pressure supply, the PLC could be programed to shut down the system if the viewport failed based on the measured test chamber pressure dropping to zero.  
>>> 
>>> CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect
>>> Save on CLICK Series Programmable Logic Controllers at AutomationDirect, your source for Click PLCs at low price...
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> These proportional pressures reducing valve could also be run with a microprocessor like Jon uses and setup in a similar way.
>>> 
>>> Best 
>>> 
>>> Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33
>>> PROPORTIONAL PRESSURE REDUCING / RELIEVING CARTRIDGE VALVE
>>> .  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 09:45:39 AM CST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi submarine friends.  I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.  The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.  An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.  My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.  
>>>   Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port  from zero to operating depth in my chamber?  
>>> Hank
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 11:50:34 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 16:50:34 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <8F1814B0-FDCD-45E5-8DF5-1BB29A650B7C@yahoo.ca>
References: <CABECYQ5bK0VnippzJabUw+Pnb0ESWM+JY=kQpUj3aGOKyCjHjg@mail.gmail.com>
 <8F1814B0-FDCD-45E5-8DF5-1BB29A650B7C@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <561825151.527168.1668531034533@mail.yahoo.com>

 Always more than one way to skin a cat.? The more options we have, the better for everyone to choose a way that fits their own capabilities.
Jon

    On Tuesday, November 15, 2022 at 10:52:14 AM EST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 Alec, yes it takes a community to do what we do. Look how far we have come collectively. ??Hank

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 15, 2022, at 7:22 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:



?Hah, I *knew* you'd come up with something like that! It's funny how each person here is either an Arduino person, a PLC person, etc. They all work.
Alec
On Tue, Nov 15, 2022 at 8:07 AM hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Hi guys, thanks for the input.? I will take it as a compliment that you think I can manage these electronic solutions. ??I will opt for a more simple system.? I ordered a compressor pressure switch.? I will modify the low pressure setting. ? The switch will activate a small solenoid to fill the chamber to 175 psi.? The chamber will have a bleed valve that is constantly bleeding very slowly.? Once the pressure drops to near zero, the switch will tell the solenoid to fill the chamber again.? We can time the cycle, and walk away for a month. ?Hank

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 13, 2022, at 8:33 PM, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:



? Hank,
I would use a direct acting cartridge style proportional pressures reducing valve, something like a Hydraforce?EHPR08-33X?Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33.? These are installed in a small aluminum manifold in which you connect hydraulic tubing with Swagelok fittings.? These valves let you specify a control signal, usually 4-20mA.? They then can be used to automatically hold the pressure and any level between zero and the maximum your pressure supply can make.? You then use a small inexpensive PLC like the Automation Direct Click PLC?CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect?along with pressure transducer and an inexpensive small touch screen display.? ?Again, you can get these from Automationdirect. You would also need to install in the PLC an analog current output that will would be connected to the proportional pressure regulator. You then program the PLC with your laptop with some simple ladder logic that sends the control current to the proportional pressure regulator to step through the pressures you want the test chamber to see over time.? Most of these small PLC's have data logging capability so you can log test chamber pressure as a function of time.? If you also installed a contactor on the power to the pressure supply, the PLC could be programed to shut down the system if the viewport failed based on the measured test chamber pressure dropping to zero.??

| 
| 
|  | 
CLICK (Stackable Micro Brick PLC) | AutomationDirect

Save on CLICK Series Programmable Logic Controllers at AutomationDirect, your source for Click PLCs at low price...
 |

 |

 |




These proportional pressures reducing valve could also be run with a microprocessor?like Jon uses and setup in a similar way.
Best?

| 
| 
|  | 
Hydraforce | Pressure Rising with Current - EHPR08-33

PROPORTIONAL PRESSURE REDUCING / RELIEVING CARTRIDGE VALVE
 |

 |

 |

.??



    On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 09:45:39 AM CST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:  
 
 Hi submarine friends.? I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.? The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.? An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.? My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.? 
? Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port? from zero to operating depth in my chamber?? 
Hank
Sent from my iPhone

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  _______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
  
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 13:32:42 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 18:32:42 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>
References: <1400997123.2288746.1668396794349@mail.yahoo.com>
 <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <643801362.610785.1668537162094@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi Hank,You say you can leave it and walk away for a month.Where are you walking to?If the epoxy fails, will the compressor run continually trying to get up to pressure & overheat?Alan

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Wed, 16 Nov 2022 at 2:08 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:   _______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 13:32:42 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 18:32:42 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>
References: <1400997123.2288746.1668396794349@mail.yahoo.com>
 <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <643801362.610785.1668537162094@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi Hank,You say you can leave it and walk away for a month.Where are you walking to?If the epoxy fails, will the compressor run continually trying to get up to pressure & overheat?Alan

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Wed, 16 Nov 2022 at 2:08 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:   _______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 13:32:42 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 18:32:42 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>
References: <1400997123.2288746.1668396794349@mail.yahoo.com>
 <06B298F5-4A09-4A5C-B9C3-2C8504E3C2E0@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <643801362.610785.1668537162094@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi Hank,You say you can leave it and walk away for a month.Where are you walking to?If the epoxy fails, will the compressor run continually trying to get up to pressure & overheat?Alan

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android 
 
  On Wed, 16 Nov 2022 at 2:08 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:   _______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 18:24:23 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Michael Dell via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2022 09:24:23 +1000
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
References: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494.ref@yahoo.ca>
 <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <CAGAT7UHEH9HVhgPvu+51HnJCwb5Wh2LmRR0A94UaRSBfWKjDrQ@mail.gmail.com>

Im interested to see the results of this testing however, epoxies do have
issues with aging, degradation of its overall thermo-mechanical properties
will occur affecting its durability, reliability and safety. It would be
interesting to compare any results with a sample that has been aged.

Mike

On Mon, 14 Nov 2022, 1:45 am hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles, <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hi submarine friends.  I just completed a pressure test to failure on our
> Cast Epoxy port.  The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.  An acrylic port this
> size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.  My Epoxy port failed at
> 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.
>   Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port  from
> zero to operating depth in my chamber?
> Hank
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 18:37:03 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2022 16:37:03 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <CAGAT7UHEH9HVhgPvu+51HnJCwb5Wh2LmRR0A94UaRSBfWKjDrQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGAT7UHEH9HVhgPvu+51HnJCwb5Wh2LmRR0A94UaRSBfWKjDrQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FF12DCAA-196C-4639-AC47-38964CE41938@yahoo.ca>

Alan , figure of speech, I will have it beside my bed, hahaha.  Actually it will be in my buddies shop. He works in his shop full time. Also the feed line to the solenoid will be restricted to avoid pressurizing the chamber too fast.  My buddies compressor is a king size machine to run his boat painting shop. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 15, 2022, at 4:24 PM, Michael Dell via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Im interested to see the results of this testing however, epoxies do have issues with aging, degradation of its overall thermo-mechanical properties will occur affecting its durability, reliability and safety. It would be interesting to compare any results with a sample that has been aged.
> 
> Mike
> 
>> On Mon, 14 Nov 2022, 1:45 am hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles, <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Hi submarine friends.  I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port.  The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD.  An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water.  My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water.  
>>   Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port  from zero to operating depth in my chamber?  
>> Hank
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 19:01:26 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2022 00:01:26 +0000
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
References: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494.ref@yahoo.ca>
 <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
Message-ID: <qs6VXT0jqNRcpA-sXlhFoCHx46IsdZyxWamexOgSTj0crNEOHETKwKvGcBIZdT0TP5wvcwmqgwFTwtjMDPY4-Y3EZritUmWEd9BNedkb1yI=@protonmail.com>

I might have chimed in here, because the design of this sort of thing is precisely what I do for a living, but my experience is likely not that relevant to the DIY'er. I work with multimillion dollar computer controlled servohydraulic load frames and pressure collapse chambers, which changes the game a bit.

Still, always interesting to see how these problems are tackled using amateur infrastructure. Looking forward to your report.

Sean

-------- Original Message --------
On Nov. 13, 2022, 08:44, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote:

> Hi submarine friends. I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port. The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD. An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water. My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water. Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port from zero to operating depth in my chamber? Hank Sent from my iPhone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Nov 15 20:42:14 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Bernie Hellstrom via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2022 01:42:14 +0000
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <qs6VXT0jqNRcpA-sXlhFoCHx46IsdZyxWamexOgSTj0crNEOHETKwKvGcBIZdT0TP5wvcwmqgwFTwtjMDPY4-Y3EZritUmWEd9BNedkb1yI=@protonmail.com>
References: <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494.ref@yahoo.ca>
 <BA12E87A-678D-43C3-B2F2-0A864B642494@yahoo.ca>
 <qs6VXT0jqNRcpA-sXlhFoCHx46IsdZyxWamexOgSTj0crNEOHETKwKvGcBIZdT0TP5wvcwmqgwFTwtjMDPY4-Y3EZritUmWEd9BNedkb1yI=@protonmail.com>
Message-ID: <BY3PR19MB5041D844FF26B788385EC90FD8079@BY3PR19MB5041.namprd19.prod.outlook.com>

Real simple!  Just do it with analog timers and relays.  ???.

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 15, 2022, at 7:02 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

?I might have chimed in here, because the design of this sort of thing is precisely what I do for a living, but my experience is likely not that relevant to the DIY'er. I work with multimillion dollar computer controlled servohydraulic load frames and pressure collapse chambers, which changes the game a bit.

Still, always interesting to see how these problems are tackled using amateur infrastructure. Looking forward to your report.

Sean

-------- Original Message --------
On Nov. 13, 2022, 08:44, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Hi submarine friends. I just completed a pressure test to failure on our Cast Epoxy port. The port was 1 inch by 8 inches OD. An acrylic port this size is rated to fail at 2,100 feet sea water. My Epoxy port failed at 1,225 psi or 2,744 feet fresh water. Any ideas on how to make a hydraulic apparatus to cycle the port from zero to operating depth in my chamber? Hank Sent from my iPhone _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Nov 24 17:08:16 2022
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2022 17:08:16 -0500
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Happy Thanksgiving!
Message-ID: <CAOGJjn+RSUrUjCo0+8whv3hnDk9mBb=xtqpQ=yNy_BhtW-8veQ@mail.gmail.com>

Happy Thanksgiving to my US psub friends, and good tidings to all my non-US
psub friends. Hope this email finds you all well.

I?m considering selling the K-250 submersible ?Snoopy? which I purchased
from Alec Smyth in 2015. She?s currently disassembled for an overhaul.
Currently waiting on my sandblaster to get back to me with a quote but he?s
been putting me off. So her hull still needs blasted and painted. All the
acrylic has been refurbished and polished up. In 2019 Alec cut off her
welded keels and replaced them with bolt-on (i.e. removable) aluminum ones.
She also has new stainless ?bumper? bars in her low forward quadrant for
viewport protection.

What she needs: sandblasting, painting, new batteries, reassembly including
re-routing of HP O2 and air lines (around new battery trays) and
re-ballasting with lead bricks (weight has changed with keel / battery
replacement).

If I sell her, I will sell everything together, including the old parts
we?ve removed from the hull (steel keels, all ballast leads and steels,
mechanical claw). Tons of extra parts and whatnot. Also spreader bar for
lifting and two welded floor stands.

 Trailer too, of course. The trailer has an extending tongue, guide rails
and winch, spare tire and jack wheel. Both sub and trailer have clean
titles I will transfer. Snoopy has her original log and Alec had also typed
up some checklists and emergency procedures stuff that are all part of the
deal.

The sub has always been stored indoors. She?s currently located in my
hangar at KFKL (Venango Regional in Franklin, PA). $20,000 firm. I really
want her to go to someone within or with strong attachment to the group so
I?m not posting on FB, Craigslist, etc.

Let me know what you guys think. Douglas Suhr
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