[PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)

Alan via Personal_Submersibles personal_submersibles at psubs.org
Mon Mar 9 18:25:36 EDT 2020 

Rick,
depending on where you are at with your build you may want to factor in
new upcoming battery technology.
The lithium sulphur battery has 4-5 times the energy density of a lithium iron
battery & will be much cheaper. So you would go 20 times further on them than
with your lead acid batteries. 
The energy density has been proven for years but there has been a problematic
degrading of the cathode due to gunk ( polysulphides) building up on them, that
results in a low number of charging cycles. 
A large number of universities & corporations World wide have been spending billions
on research to overcome this problem & it looks like Monash University in Australia
has an answer. They say they will be in production in 2 years.
So you may want to buy cheap lead acids & a cheap charger now with view to
upgrading when the lithium sulphur batteries hit the market. They require a balance
charger that monitors individual cels.
Alan
https://www.downtoearth.org.in/video/energy/world-s-most-efficient-lithium-sulphur-battery-developed-in-australia-68702


> On 10/03/2020, at 10:04 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Thanks Cliff for the data. I'll check out what you sent and also just wanted some feedback from those on the site as to what they are using for the type of battery's they have and how they like them which you have done.
> I'll also reach out to the battery manufacturer that I pick to ask them about the proper charging rates recommended for that particular battery. I guess my main concern is that the charger that I pick knows when to shut off and turn back on so I don't ruin the battery's. 
> I learned the hard way by buying a charger that didn't know to shut off and I ruined the batteries on my sailboat.
> Rick
> 
> 
>> On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 10:13 AM Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> I have used Zivan EV battery chargers for 15 years on the R300. When the boat drive train included a jet ski motor with impeller, I used the Zivan NG3 model NG3-120-18 to charge the 120VDC nominal AGM main battery.  When I switch over to Minn Kota 101 trolling motors, the main battery bus voltage was reduced to 36VDC nominal and I switched to a Zivan NG3 model NG3-36-60.  In both cases, the battery charger was installed within the pressure hull so that I could easily recharge.  I have been very happy with these chargers and never had a failure.  See Zivan NG3 Battery Charger
>> 
>> Zivan NG3 Battery Charger
>> Fireworks Splice HTML
>>  for more info.
>> 
>> When you order these units, supplier will need to know the type (lead, AGM, gel) and nominal voltage of the battery you are charging to set specific parameters on the charger to match your battery bank.  On both chargers, I purchased the optional thermal sensor as these chargers charge at different rate depending on temperature.  See Zivan Charge Curves
>> 
>> Zivan Charge Curves
>> Fireworks Splice HTML
>>  for the three charge phases.
>> 
>> They are a bit pricey but can be found on Ebay often.
>> 
>> If you are into PLCs, these units have an optional interface for monitoring the charge.  If you are not into PLCs, then you can just connect the charger to the battery bank and plug it in to an AC source and monitor the charge manually either through a remote display or the display on the unit itself.
>> 
>> I am not arguing that this charger is better or worse than other heavy duty charger, it is just the one that I have the had the most experience with.
>> 
>>  
>> Cliff
>> 
>> On Sunday, March 8, 2020, 03:17:42 PM CDT, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hey guys, any other feed back on what you use for a battery charger for 12 or 36 volts, Sean, whats your input?
>> Rick
>> 
>> On Sun, Mar 8, 2020 at 9:48 AM Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Alan,           According to the specs an my batteries is shows a low voltage of 5 volts .     But better battery life if discharged less than 50 %   
>> 
>> https://resources.fullriverbattery.com/fullriver-battery/external-media/spec-sheets/DC220-6.pdf 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Brian
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2020 21:29:48 +1300
>> 
>> Brian,
>> It is recommended not to take lead acid batteries below 50% charge,  or 12.2V.
>> So 48.8V.
>> However when you have a heavy load on them they indicate a lower voltage than
>> what they will be if you stop the motor & let them recover.
>> Alan
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> On 8/03/2020, at 7:04 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> David,   yes I'm running off my batteries, they are AGM, I have eight  240  ah  batteries.  I'm not sure how low I can go with the voltage,   I believe the storage indicator has a low limit where it would read zero, but I'm pretty sure the motors will run on 36 volts,  there is most likely a recommended low voltage for the 12 volt batteries.   I ran them for 6 hours and the storage indicator was telling me 40% full.  Voltage was 44.3  
>> 
>> Rick,  this is the battery charger I have:   https://www.batterypete.com/chargers/golf-carts/delta-q-quiq-48-volt-18-amp-912-4800/?gclid=Cj0KCQiAqY3zBRDQARIsAJeCVxP7pOTpKjANY_Z4leDJMXsag_kgsFsDIKImLms-Qd7CIh43hEoq7_oaAruDEALw_wcB
>> 
>> Brian
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>   
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2020 21:02:11 -0800
>> 
>> Brian, are you running them from your actual batteries? Are they deep cycle lead AGM, or LIPO4? What's the cut off voltage?
>> David
>> 
>> On Sat, Mar 7, 2020, 7:58 PM Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> It's been 4 hours now and my voltage is at 46.44 volts
>> 
>> Brian
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2020 15:48:43 +1300
>> 
>> Hi Brian,
>> 3hp is 2,200W, so 500W with no load seems excessively high.
>> Just measured mine & it's .9Amps (900mAh) for a 1500W compensated motor running in a 5cst silicone oil. Running off 48V also. So under 49W.
>> I think you have a large prop on your motors. I just saw your gearing ratio, but the
>> loss shouldn't be that much.
>> I would test them individually in case one is at fault.
>> Cheers Alan
>> 
>> On 8/03/2020, at 2:54 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,             They are 3 hp golf cart motors, true there is no load but If I kept the same amp draw while actually at sea then it seems it would be equivalent.     Under actual conditions it would probably be going very slowly while drawing 21 amps ( 10.5 amps per motor ) .  
>> 
>> Brian
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2020 14:21:54 +1300
>> 
>> Brian,
>> I take it that there is no load on the motor!
>> That seems a high power consumption, 500 Watts per motor.
>> Have you got the specs for those motors? Have you checked them individually?
>> Alan
>> 
>> On 8/03/2020, at 1:26 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> There are some times when 110 vac could be needed, like computer stuff.   Just a thought, we can have an open mind on the subject !  
>> 
>> 
>>   Right now I'm running my motors to see how long they'll go.  It's a kind of cool rainy day so the temperature is close to what the ocean would be .   I've got the oil expansion tube going into a bucket so I can get an idea how large of a reservoir I will need to take care of the expansion.  I think I'm going to opt for just a reservoir on the motor side and then I'm running a hose up high and then back down to take care of the compression up the tube for when I submerge.  Since most of the compression of air will occur in the first 30' the water should never get high enough ( in the tube) to go over the hump and get into the motor compartment.   So the whole system will be open .    I'm also monitoring Voltage ,  Amp draw, and ,  Watts     48 volts       21 amps       1030  watts    - two motors running  .
>> 
>>   
>> 
>> Brian
>>     
>> 
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2020 00:06:47 +0000 (UTC)
>> 
>> Why complicate a simple solution?  this works great!  Bad Brian!
>> 
>> Hank
>> 
>> On Saturday, March 7, 2020, 4:59:49 PM MST, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> There are a lot of 110AC led's out there , it would be a simple matter to run a DC inverter to make 110ac voltage ,  I wonder if there would be any advantage to that,  there might be some better quality led's that are made for AC voltage, Any thoughts on that?
>> 
>> Brian
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject)
>> Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2020 16:30:26 +0000 (UTC)
>> 
>>                             15:13 Now playing Watch later Watch later Add to queue Add to queue                
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>> 	
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>> In this video I am converting an everyday LED light bar into the deep diving, oil filled, underwater light bar t...
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>> 
>> 
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