[PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: DOSITS: Forward Looking Sonar

Fri May 15 15:14:43 EDT 2015

Cliff, Scott,
I was looking at the panoptix forward scanning sonar from Garmin
http://sites.garmin.com/en-US/panoptix/
& the Simrad 2D forward scan. Neither the N.Z. expert for Simrad or
the Australasian manager for Garmin could tell me about the transducers
construction & were dubious about their ability to withstand 250 psi.
I would probably want it to be pressure resistant to 500 psi (twice operating depth)
The Simrad is about $700 & the Garmin about $1500 so don't want to experiment.
The Simrad expert was also unsure of the 2D models ability to shoot through
fiberglass & operate effectively. These are mounted vertically so couldn't in normal
boating applications be mounted inside the hull due to hull shape.
   The Simrad transducers are designed at theTulsa Navaco office in Oklahoma. 
That's just across the border from you Cliff. An alternative to the fibreglass plate
I suggested may be to pot the whole unit up to 1/2" thick in fiberglass & fix it to
the hull with o-rings around the electrical through hull.
I had a look at your DST800 Cliff. It has a paddle wheel in it. How deep will the
paddle wheel go before water will push through it's seal & into it's electronics??
cheers, Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 16/05/2015, at 1:53 am, Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan, I am not sure packaging a fish finder sounder transducer in a 1-atm pod is necessary for 500ft.  My guess is most of these are fully potted and cab take the pressure. 
> 
> BTW, I am implementing a Airmar DST800 DST800 —Thru-Hull, Smart™ Sensor - Airmar Marine Transducers part of my R300 upgrade.  This sensor will give me altitude, speed and water temp.  The sensor sends out a NMEA 0183 ASCII sentence string that I will connect via RS232 serial feed into a coprocessor on my PLC.  I then can parse the string to get data.  I am using the same coprocessor so parse another transducer that gives me roll, pitch and heading.  This transducer is packaged in a custom 1-atm anodized aluminum housing.
> 
> I looked at ROV sounders but these are expensive at $1500-$4000 each where these fish finder sounders are cheap. 
> 
> Cliff
> 
> 
> 
> Cliff Redus
> Redus Engineering
> USA mobile:  830-931-1280
> cliffordredus at sbcglobal.com
> 
> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
> Sent: Friday, May 15, 2015 4:41 AM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: DOSITS: Forward Looking Sonar
> 
> Have just come back from the local boat show after talking to a couple of
> exhibitors about sonar / depth sounders.
> I am still finding my way here. Was told I could mount a forward looking sonar inside
> a fiberglass hull & would loose about 15% of my range as apposed to in water mounting.
> They said the depth sounder worked better than the forward looking sonar through fiberglass.
> Why not have a small view port type arrangement in the bottom or up front of the submarine
> with a fiberglass plate in it. Then glue the transducer to that.
> For a 3" diameter fiberglass plate .55" thick, I get a 4000ft crush depth. Safety factor of 4 for
> plastics I think, so 500ft capable operating depth.
> Quote from installation pdfs below......
> As an alternative to transom mounting, it is possible on many
> fiberglass-hulled boats to glue the transducer on the inside of
> the boat hull. Since fiberglass has similar sonar
> characteristics as water, the sonar signal can pass through
> the boat hull with minimal loss. The hull of the boat must be
> single layer construction (not double-hulled) Also, any air
> trapped in the lamination of the fiberglass would prevent the
> sonar signal from passing through.
> Inside the hull installations require no holes be drilled into the
> boat and through experimentation, high-speed operation
> comparable to transom mounting can be achieved. Two-part
> slow cure epoxy (not included) is required to glue the transducer in place.
> ......In-hull: Installed against the inside of the hull bottom, the in-hull transducer sends its signal through the hull. “Shoot through hull” transducers do not need direct water contact. They’re glued to the inside of the hull with silicone or epoxy. An in-hull transducer is a good choice for a trailered boat, a vessel with a stepped hull, and for other types of high performance hull designs, as there is no drag, hull penetration or potential for fouling. No integrated temperature sensor. Can be installed while boat is in the water. For deadrise angles up to 30 degrees. As with thru-hulls, the selected location should be aft and close to the centerline so that the transducer is in the water at all times.
> In-hull transducers need solid fiberglass at the mounting location; no foam or plywood coring material, or air pockets. A typical 600W transducer can transmit through 1/2" to 5/8" (12-16mm) of fiberglass. To install inside a cored hull, find a location with no coring or remove the core material.
> Alan
> 
> 
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
> Sent: Monday, May 11, 2015 5:10 AM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: DOSITS: Forward Looking Sonar
> 
> Looks really nice Hank, but couldn't find a price.
> They are marketing to ship owners not recreational boat market.
> Had looked at other 3d forward scanners & they are quite a bit more than
> the Sinrad 2d.
> Alan 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> > On 11/05/2015, at 12:26 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > Alan,
> > Check this system out, you probably have seen it.  This would be very nice to have.
> > Hank
> >> --- On Sun, 5/10/15, hank pronk <hankpronk at live.ca> wrote:
> >> 
> >> From: hank pronk <hankpronk at live.ca>
> >> Subject: DOSITS: Forward Looking Sonar
> >> To: "hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca" <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca>
> >> Received: Sunday, May 10, 2015, 8:25 AM
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> http://www.dosits.org/technology/locatingobjectsusingsonar/forwardlookingsonar/
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> 
> 
> 
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