[PSUBS-MAILIST] bolt in penetration

Sat Jan 10 15:39:12 EST 2015

Sean,
I had Brian look for a plate and there is none.  I will start by trying to find the manufacturer through the university on Monday. 
Hank
--------------------------------------------
On Sat, 1/10/15, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] bolt in penetration
 To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 Received: Saturday, January 10, 2015, 3:15 PM

 If the university doesn't have the info, it
 should at least be traceable. All vessels built to ASME
 Section VIII Division 1 require a nameplate that will list
 the manufacturer, serial number, etc. Failing that,
 metallurgical tests are possible, but a bit more
 involved.
 Sean

 On January 10, 2015
 12:54:26 PM MST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 Sean,
 Is
 there a on site test that can be done to determine the
 alloy?  
 Hank

 On Sat, 1/10/15, Sean T. Stevenson via
 Personal_Submersibles
 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

  Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST]
 bolt in penetration
  To: "Personal
 Submersibles General Discussion"
 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>

 Received: Saturday, January 10, 2015, 2:46 PM

  Parallel projects... Sister
 subs... Could be
  fun.

 Sean

  On January 10, 2015
  12:19:38 PM MST, hank pronk via
 Personal_Submersibles

 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

  Yes but

 there two of them.
  Hank
  On
 Sat, 1/10/15, Sean T. Stevenson via

 Personal_Submersibles

 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

   Subject: Re:
 [PSUBS-MAILIST]
  bolt in penetration
   To: "Personal

 Submersibles General
 Discussion"

 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>

  Received: Saturday, January 10, 2015, 2:16
 PM

   If it is suitable, I
 presume
  you're calling

  dibs?

  Sean

   On
 January 10, 2015
   12:10:14 PM MST, hank
 pronk via
  Personal_Submersibles

 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

   Sean,
   I
 may
  be able to on Monday.  The sphere
 was
   owned
  by a university
 and we can contact them to find the

 manufacturer.  Given that is was used as a

 pressure vessel
   paid for by a
 university
  working on a government project,
 I
   have to
  assume it is
 good stuff.  Not very scientific but a

 fair assumption at!
    this

 stage.  Luckily it is right in

 Brian's
  back yard in California so he
 was able to look
   at it and might be able
 to do some detective
  work.

 Hank
   On Sat, 1/10/15, Sean T. Stevenson
 via
   Personal_Submersibles

  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 wrote:

    Subject: Re:
  [PSUBS-MAILIST]
   bolt in
 penetration
    To: "Personal

  Submersibles General
 Discussion"

 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>

   Received: Saturday, January 10, 2015,
 2:02
  PM

    Hank, any chance you
  can
   find out what the alloy

 is? This will have
   a

 profound effect on its efficacy.
    Sean

    On!

  January
   10, 2015
    11:51:22
  AM MST, hank pronk
 via

 Personal_Submersibles

  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 wrote:

    Sean, 

   Thank
 you, that is helpful.  My idea was
  to

   make the insert as t!
   ight as
  possible (sweat it
 in)  I a!
  m

 not
    sure if the difference in material
   would cause a problem

  though. The idea of
   seating
 the port into
  the shell a good

   option

 also.  I am just chewing the fat here, I have
   enough
    on my plate but it
 is
  fun to think
   about.  I
 was wrong about
    the size, the
   sphere is 6
  feet and I wrote
 60 in.  I imagine
    that

 kills the rating quite a bit?
    Hank
    On Sat, 1/10/15,
    Sean
 T.
  Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles

 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>

  wrote:

 Subject: Re:
   [PSUBS-MAILIST]
    bolt in
  penetration
     To: "Personal

   Submersibles General

 Discussion"

  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>

 Received: Saturday, January 10, 2015!
    ,
 1:40
   PM

     You could certainly!

 do
  that,
    although a
 three inch
     thick shell is pretty
   !

  substantial - I might consider

   machining
    eg. conical window
  seats in
 the
   hull sh!

  ell
     directly,
   and then
  derating the
 hull
    to a depth
   whereby
 the
     actual hull

   thickness is the effective

 derated thickness
     plus the effective
  reinforcement, which
   just

  happens to be a

 contiguous shell.  The
    bolt-in
  arrangement
   would not act
 as
     hull

  reinforcement though -
 unless it was a force fit in the
     hole.
 The idea of reinforcements around

 openings is to
     provide

 material around the
    hole to
  carry the shell
   hoop

  stresses that
    would

 otherwise have passed through the

 material in the opening, such that you

 don't increase
     the

 nominal shell
   stress. This requires a
    (relatively)
     smooth
 load
  path to redirect

   stress
  around the hol!
   e.
  Br!

 ian
     recently
    asked
 me
   about the

 effectiveness of reinforcements

   like perpendicular flanges lining the
 hole,

   and this is a
     bit complicated, because

  some
    stress i!
      s
   indeed

 redirected into
   such a flange, but the
 load
  is not evenly

  distributed as you move
 inboar!
     d or
    outboard
 away from the

  hull
   shell (with

  diminishing returns at

 increasing

 distances),
   and you also introduce a
 stress
  concentration

 at
     the
  perpendicular
   transition. Ideally,  
 reinforcements
   should

 be an effective

 thickening of the hull in the region

    immediately adjacent to
  the
 opening, tapered
   smoothly

   back
     (something
   like
 4:1) into the hull

  shell
 to provide
   a

  continuous load path

   with
  no stress
  concentrations at abrupt

   changes in geometry.
     Sean

  On

 January 10, 2015 8:25:39
   !

   AM
 MST, hank pronk via

 Personal_Submersibles

 <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>

  wrote:
     Is it feasible
 to

  have a
     bolt in penetration in a 3 inch
   thick sphere
    hull.  I
 am

   picturing machining
 a hole
  in
    the hull,
   then
  inserting a
     window housing
    with a
 shoulder!
  (flange)
 that fits tight in

 the hole and is bolted
  in

 place.  Can that arrangement
    act
     as reinforcement for
  the
 hul!
     l.

    Hank

 Personal_Submersibles
  mailing list

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