[PSUBS-MAILIST] Great White mods

Joe Perkel josephperkel at yahoo.com
Sun Feb 9 13:09:26 EST 2014 

At that level Vance Id be switching to the Range Rover waiting in the T-Hangar at the Sebring Airport and drive the 5 minutes to the house. SR22 is precisely what I would do if I could.

Thanks for the advice on the acrylic housings, I had not considered that, it is brilliant in its simplicity!

Joe




On Sunday, February 9, 2014 11:28 AM, "vbra676539 at aol.com" <vbra676539 at aol.com> wrote:
 
I was just reading about an Xi Sirrus 22. Wouldn't that be a nice little plane for week-end hops to Sebring? Sweet. All you'd need to do would be to clear a 1500' strip next to the house, and you're in business. 

As to the small cameras, I was thinking a camera low in the stern, maybe looking back between the pods at the thrusters, with enough wide-angle to keep the bottom in sight. Lots of other options, as well. They'd be easy to mount. Partially drill a piece of acrylic solid stock (round stock), polish the ends, thread the opening. Have the camera mounted to the inboard side of a bulkhead connector. Screw the acrylic down, instant housing. I'm thinking not expensive, and you could have several of them, switchable, for looking out and recording as needed.

Towing is always a problem. Perry's original PC-3 class towed pretty nicely due to the long MBT and enclosed VBT forward. Pretty soon, however, it got to be a shipboard deal, so towing was merely for convenience or launch and recovery sequences. The Nektons, on the other hand, tow like a house afire (10 knots, if you've got enough grunt in the boat). No one else has really ever tried it except Paul Moorhouse. It looks like their big window behind and under a forward tank is a good compromise, but I have never messed with his subs directly (unfortunately).

Carsten's design tows okay, I suspect, but slowly. Their little subs are kissing cousins to Aquarius in shape with probably more stability due to the chord shaped fins aft. The A-boat (towed by the stern) tended to plunge above say 4 knots or so, and then the top deck makes a really nice aileron and down you go. Unhandy.

Vance



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Perkel <josephperkel at yahoo.com>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Sun, Feb 9, 2014 10:26 am
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Great White mods


Vance,

Everything is miniaturized these days. I just bought a flexible inspection camera at Home Dept for a 100 bucks with a 2" color screen that I used to locate a problem behind a wall. When I was an aircraft mechanic, a similar bore-scope would have set you back thousands.

I'm thinking dual usage in recording HD video on a DVR of the dive and critters, and a live feed from the bow camera to a 2" - 4" LCD screen mounted on one side of the forward facing port in the tower. On the other side of the same port could the sonar display. As an instrument rated pilot, I'm used to the notion of developing a scan between instrumentation and the outside world.

Everything's a compromise Vance. I'm struggling between an elongated bow shape for surface transit, or a blunt nose draggy
 type shape that tugs and dances on the towline. Everything's a long way off down in the Keys.

Joe





On Sunday, February 9, 2014 9:41 AM, "vbra676539 at aol.com" <vbra676539 at aol.com> wrote:
 
I have no experience with them. Do you mean something like back-up cameras for cars and RVs? I'll tell you this. Blind spots can provide some surprises if you mess around long enough. Little boats like a DW can be spun in place to see behind or underneath. Longer subs not so much. It's worth thinking about, as considering availability, I'll bet cameras like that could be used and (with a little housing fiddle and wiring) wouldn't be all that expensive. In the hundreds of dollars range, I'll bet, rather than thousands.  
Vance



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Perkel <josephperkel at yahoo.com>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Sun, Feb 9, 2014 8:40 am
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Great White mods


Vance,

How effective and practical are today's live camera and LCD displays for supplemental viewing?

Joe




On Saturday, February 8, 2014 7:29 PM, "vbra676539 at aol.com" <vbra676539 at aol.com> wrote:
 
Joe,  

It's something to keep in mind, that view angle. The K's work nicely if you are lying down, and a big dome port is even better. But if you measure the line of sight from say a K-350 front conning port, over the ballast tank and to the ground in front, it is a long, long way. Distance is your enemy down there. Even in good viz, details wash out quickly.

Vance



-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Perkel <josephperkel at yahoo.com>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Sent: Sat, Feb 8, 2014 5:42 pm
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Great White mods


Vance,

External Hookah's, how interesting. That set up looks pretty ideal for shallow water salvage or archeology. I looked again and found the uncovered aluminum frame.

Your comment regarding pilot angle of view has bothered me for a number of years on my own design. I've repeatedly struggled with this very issue which is why my recent renewal of interest in the Nektons, and Hanks efforts in particular.


Jim,

Another look and I think you're correct in your assessment that those slats are synthetic flooring or decking. Note the concentric (plastic?) ring that butts up against the ribs for screw attachment.


Joe





On Saturday, February 8, 2014 5:01 PM, "JimToddPsub at aol.com" <JimToddPsub at aol.com> wrote:
 
 
Joe,
 
Yes, I would like to see more of the details on the makeover, 
but Scott's intended audience was not sub design enthusiasts.  His focus 
was more on drawing people into support of the mission which is a very 
important one.  He has mentioned getting the Great White to a Psubs 
convention.  That would be a great opportunity to really look it over and 
probably hear a presentation.
 
Jim
 
In a message dated 2/8/2014 2:25:16 P.M. Central Standard Time, vbra676539 at aol.com writes:
Joe,  
>
>
>The external deck mounted scuba tanks  are for hookah rigs, as I understand it. The rest of it seems to have been  built in aluminum angle to contain big MBTs and shield the other equipment.  Still no manipulator. He could really use one of those, maybe a  ball-and-socket variant welded in next to the front viewport? The wheels are a  cool little addition. Obviously they have enough bearing strength, and they  can launch and retrieve off channel ramps rather than trying to find a boat  ramp and trailer tongue long enough to back the whole thing down. Neat  solution.
>
>
>Vance
>
>
>
>-----Original  Message-----
>From: Joe Perkel <josephperkel at yahoo.com>
>To: 
  Personal Submersibles General Discussion 
  <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>Sent: Sat, Feb 8, 2014 3:16 
  pm
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Great White mods
>
>
>Jim, 
>
>
>
>Did  you catch the external "Rescue Ballast" valve handles? I really liked that!  Clearly marked and self explanatory, much like the canopy release on military  AC.
>
>
>The  rest of the design is harder to follow the train of thought. It would be  helpful to see a cutaway, wire-frame, or ghosted image. Did I miss one  somewhere?
>
>
>Joe
>
>
>
>On Saturday, February 8, 2014 2:33 PM,  "JimToddPsub at aol.com" <JimToddPsub at aol.com>  wrote:
>
> 
>OFF LIST
>Yeah, Scott is a great guy, but he's a man on a  mission.  I'm sure he will read the emails referencing Great White or  Undersea Voyager project.
> 
>I suspect the interior materials used were either synthetic  wood flooring or synthetic decking material.  Both are far superior to  real wood for this application, but you would have to check for off-gassing  properties both from general usage in a confined space or in the event of a  fire.
> 
>Jim
> 
>In a message dated 2/8/2014 1:18:33 P.M. Central Standard Time, josephperkel at yahoo.com writes:
> 
>>Thanks Jim, 
>>
>>
>>
>>Somehow  I get the feeling this fellow Scott is too busy for chit chat!
>>
>>
>>Joe
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On Saturday, February 8, 2014 2:07 PM,  "JimToddPsub at aol.com" <JimToddPsub at aol.com>  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>Joe,
>> 
>>If you got to http://www.underseavoyagerproject.org/ and scroll  down to the Mission Video you'll see some shots of the interior, but there  is no description of the materials used.
>> 
>>Here's another video before its latest makeover:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-XGT8rPZs8
>> 
>>Jim
>> 
>>In a message dated 2/8/2014 10:26:39 A.M. Central Standard Time, josephperkel at yahoo.com writes:
>> 
>>>Jim,
>>>
>>>
>>>There is a photo somewhere of that subs interior. One can clearly see  longitudinal slats mounted inside and over the ribs.
>>>
>>>
>>>I'd like to know what those are as they give the interior a smother  neater appearance and an apparent mounting surface.
>>>
>>>
>>>Joe
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On Feb 7, 2014, at 11:21 PM, JimToddPsub at aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>>>Here's another article showing the external mods to Great  White.  It doesn't look much like a K-250 anymore.  There's a  photo gallery about 70% of the way down.  -Jim
>>>>http://californiadiver.com/undersea-voyager-project-completes-final-submarine-test-dives/
>>>_______________________________________________
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