[PSUBS-MAILIST] window test chamber

Joe Perkel josephperkel at yahoo.com
Fri Nov 1 19:37:31 EDT 2013 

Hank,
 
I think that's pretty neat. It does bring a question though.
 
If the acrylic has known properties at "X" thickness, is there still a need to test? Is it the material itself that needs testing, the  seal, or frame?, I'm not clear here.
 
Joe

________________________________
From: hank pronk <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
Sent: Friday, November 1, 2013 5:01 PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] window test chamber



Rick,
I posted a picture of my window test chamber under Gamma restoration.  The chamber is built entirely from scrap in my shop.  I tested the first window to 500psi.  Yes I was nervous :_)   The top ring is a 1in thick window frame I had from a previous project.  The side of the chamber is 1/4 flat bar bent around and the base is 3/4in plate.  I machined an o-ring groove in the base that bolts to a 5/8 disk left over from building my hatch.   I also had to machine the inside of the window frame again after welding it together.  The window sits on a gasket and is bolted as if it were on the sub.
Hank


________________________________
From: Land N Sea <landnsea1 at hawaiiantel.net>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 9:19:06 PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] window test chamber

I was considering doing the same thing, fabricating a test pot to take one to failure just out of curiosity and piece of mind as well as test the rest to 600’ before installing them but figured it might me costly to do, so kind of gave up the idea. Let us know your design with any pictures you may have of it and an idea or your cost outlay if you don’t mind and would still like to do it if feasible. I cringe at the idea of a port light failure on the sub when testing and have to reel in a real heavy object full of sea water from 600’!! Good luck and let us know how it went.

Rick

From: hank pronk 
Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 2:49 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion 
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] window test chamber

Rick,
Thanks', your right, it will be much safer.  I am only testing to 1,000 feet, I don't think my chamber will handle a destruction test.
Hank 


________________________________
From: Land N Sea <landnsea1 at hawaiiantel.net>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 6:37:15 PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] window test chamber

Back in my diving days our company retested a couple of deck chambers and they filled them completely with water leaving no air at all so if it ruptured, there would be little or no bang. If you are testing it to failure then I guess you would still need some air on the LP side so you are back to an air gap. Get a long hose with the valve on your end and stand outside the building and peek around the corner. 

Rick 

From: hank pronk 
Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 1:45 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion 
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] window test chamber

Today I built a window pressure test chamber.  When the window is in the chamber there is a small air space remaining.  Should that space be filled with water while the window is under pressure. The space is about 250ml.
Hank


________________________________
From: hank pronk <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 10:53:07 AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Hatch mechanisms

Since the force on the puller hub is directed outward in this application, the loss of material for an oversize size rod should not matter.  
Hank


________________________________
From: Alec Smyth <alecsmyth at gmail.com>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 9:31:43 AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Hatch mechanisms

Can one drill out the puller thread and cut a new slightly larger one in coarse thread?
On Wed, Oct 30, 2013 at 10:37 AM, hank pronk <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca> wrote: 
James,
>It's like the puller was made for it.  Be aware though, with the fine thread it is slow to unlatch.  A real coarse thread, would be faster.  My original idea was to use a scissor jack threaded rod and nut.
>Hank
>
>From: James Frankland <jamesf at guernseysubmarine.com>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 7:52:05 AM 
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Hatch mechanisms
>Hank,
>Looks like a nice simple solution.  Thanks for sharing that one.  I've got loads of flywheel pullers and the like that could be adapted.
>Regards
>James
>
>On 30 October 2013 12:29, hank pronk <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca> wrote: 
>James,
>>The hatch picture is with new sub on the project page.  
>>Hank
>>
>>From: "jimtoddpsub at aol.com" <jimtoddpsub at aol.com>
>>To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org 
>>Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2013 6:13:10 AM 
>>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Hatch mechanisms
>>Checklist item:  Proper tools onboard in the event a component of the hatch mechanism binds or breaks.
>>-----Original Message-----From: James Frankland <jamesf at guernseysubmarine.com>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>Sent: Wed, Oct 30, 2013 6:51 amSubject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Hatch mechanisms 
>>slightly lower seat! 
>>On 30 October 2013 11:40, Joe Perkel <josephperkel at yahoo.com> wrote: 
>>Speaking of this hatch issue, would all this extra hardware present a head butting problem? How to deal with that? A more dished profile, or a slightly taller conning tower? 
>>>JoeSent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad 
>>>From: James Frankland <jamesf at guernseysubmarine.com>; To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>; 
>>>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Hatch mechanisms Sent: Wed, Oct 30, 2013 10:06:59 AM 
>>>Hank,
>>>How does the mechanism work?  turning the wheel obviosly lifts the ends under the hatch lip.  Dont suppose you have a dwg?
>>>Regards
>>>James
>>>On 29 October 2013 18:15, hank pronk <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca> wrote: 
>>>Jim,
>>>>that is exactly what I did with my k350 hatch.  I didn't have tie rods yet so I put adjusting bolts in the dogs.  I intent to change to tie rods from go carts.  This is very easy to build.  The slide system is the easiest to fabricate though and less complicated.  Gamma has slides.
>>>>Hank
>>>>From: James Frankland <jamesf at guernseysubmarine.com>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2013 10:20:14 AMSubject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Hatch mechanisms
>>>>Hi Jim.  I reckon i took that picture!  unless you took one almost exactly the same!  Its the lanzarote sub i think, i remember sending it to someone, Brent i think.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>>On 29 October 2013 14:38, <jimtoddpsub at aol.com> wrote: 
>>>>On this hatch mechanism the dogs pivot instead of sliding.  The arms are threaded to adjust  the length turnbuckle style.
>>>>>
>>>>>For sliding dogs, beveling them where they contact the latch point allows them to progressively tighten as they move into place.  The latch points on the tower should either be replaceable or have replaceable wear plates.  That also allows you to change the thickness of the wear plates in order to adjust the pressure of the hatch to the landing.
>>>>>-Jim
>>>>>-----Original Message-----From: James Frankland <jamesf at guernseysubmarine.com>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>Sent: Tue, Oct 29, 2013 6:53 amSubject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-350 Mods 
>>>>>anything like that would be ok by the looks of things.  That one is good because it only requires one through hull. 
>>>>>On 29 October 2013 11:25, Joe Perkel <josephperkel at yahoo.com> wrote: 
>>>>>James,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>2400 series, look for drawings at bottom of page for that series. The cast hatches are of no value to us but the mechanisms I believe are.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Joe
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Sent from Yahoo! Mail for iPad 
>>>>>>From: James Frankland <jamesf at guernseysubmarine.com>; To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>; Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-350 Mods Sent: Tue, Oct 29, 2013 11:15:49 AM 
>>>>>>I cant see the one you mean Joe, is there a product number?
>>>>>>On 29 October 2013 10:54, Joe Perkel <josephperkel at yahoo.com> wrote: 
>>>>>>James,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>Ive given thought to the hatch in the past, take a look at freeman marine and look at the cam mechanism with dogs, http://www.freemanmarine.com/ProductsHatches.htm
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>Could not a rotating shaft pass through the center to both sides via same thru-hull as side thrusters, with a wheel on both sides and a similar cam mechanism on the inside? Upward Port moved a bit forward then, and beef up the hinge for extra weight as you said.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>Joe
>>>>>>>From: James Frankland <jamesf at guernseysubmarine.com>
>>>>>>>To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org; PSUBS Member Discussion Group <member-forum at psubs.org> 
>>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2013 5:55 AM
>>>>>>>Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] K-350 Mods
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Jon\Joe sent a message yesterday i think regarding suggested K-350 modifications.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I would suggest these as critical.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>1.  Hatch.  Opening from both sides.  Worst part of the design I think.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>2.  Hatch bracket.  Could do with beefing up, it feels a bit flimsy.  Probably could do with some traingular flanges welding on.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>3.  Variable tank mounting.  The way the tank mounts is awkward and doesnt allow any adjustment.  Much easier and better would be flat horizontal brackets welded to the battery pods that join to corresponding flat brackets on the vbt.  Slotted holes on one of the planes would allow the tank to slide forward and back a little to allow that awkward vent to be fitted easily.  Also the tank could be just lifted up and on.  Very simple change.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I think other than that, other modifications are depending on how much trouble you want to go to and cosmetics.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>For example,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I changed the battery pod endcap seals.  I had a real pain trying to make them as per the plans.  The way i did them in the end with flanges was a lot easier.  But probably nothing wrong with the original design.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Skids.  I didnt like the ones shown, they would just get all the paint knocked off.  Again, probably nothing wrong with the original design.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I made all the flanges and protrutions from stainless.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Electrical penetrators added to the battery pods to eliminate the ones shown on the plans.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The 2 extra downward facing viewports i put in are really good.  You could do away with the ones at the back and put them there instead if you didnt want to make too many.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The dome of course.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Overpressure valve.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>loads of little modifications.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I'm at work, and i better get on with some of it, instead of daydreaming about subs!
>>>>>>>Kind Regards
>>>>>>>James_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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