[PSUBS-MAILIST] G.L. Summary Stability & Buoyancy

Sun Dec 8 14:10:39 EST 2013

Rick,
All my windows are annealed and what ever else they do to make them certified.  I have paper work on each individual port with test results.  I will test the ports in the same fashion, pressurize them then measure deflection up to one hr.
  Sounds like you are well on your way, I would strongly recommend adding two ports to you CT.   The difference is absolutely worth the effort.  I think Vance mentioned that it is fine to do so with the design.  Make a CT out of cardboard with 6 ports and try it out.
Hank

On Sunday, December 8, 2013 11:45:55 AM, Land N Sea <landnsea1 at hawaiiantel.net> wrote:

Hank, 
I forgot if you mentioned it or not but had that port been annealed before 
testing? 
My main ports are 8” X 1 1/4”. It’s hard to say percentage wise how far I 
am along as each phase is different labor wise plus not have built one before, 
it’s hard to put a value to it but,,,,,,,,,,,hull seam and all frames and 4 view 
port rings in and fully welded, threw hulls for side motors, steering linkage, 
drop weights and VBT vent and flood are in, lower ring for conn in, upper ring 
for conn including 4 view port rings, threw hulls for MBT dump, snorkel and 
hatch dogs done and ready to weld to lower ring already on hull, hatch done and 
ready to install, both battery pods are completely done and I have decided to 
take them out and individually test them to 600’ before attaching them to the 
hull as I have 3 places in each pod that have O rings where a leak could occur 
unlike the construction drawings, so I want the option of getting them in a 
lathe to correct any warpage  if need be as once they are on the hull no 
can do. Front dished end has large view port ring installed, rear dished end has 
the 2” flood nipple in all steel has been sand blasted and primed, I have the 
three Minn-Kotas but still need to modify them, VBT is done and ready to mount. 
I also have the depth sounder, U/W comms, gas chromatograph, scrubber and O2 
cleaned first stage reg as well. It sounds like I have done a lot but then when 
I think of what is still left to do, it really doesn’t. I guess if it were easy 
everybody would be doing it. 

Rick 

From: hank pronk  
Sent: Sunday, December 08, 2013 3:16 AM 
To: Personal Submersibles General 
Discussion  
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] G.L. Summary Stability & 
Buoyancy 

Rick, 
The ports for Gamma are 1.5in thick and 8.5in dia.  What stage 
are you at with your build? 
Hank 

On Saturday, December 7, 2013 7:30:03 PM, 
Land N Sea <landnsea1 at hawaiiantel.net> wrote:

What was the thickness and diameter of the one you tested? I'm  good 
on ports and am going to send all mine to Greg for annealing but it’s good to 
know you have them for the future if need be. 

Rick 

From: hank pronk  
Sent: Saturday, December 07, 2013 1:19 PM 
To: Personal 
Submersibles General Discussion  
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] G.L. Summary Stability & 
Buoyancy 

Hi Rick, 
I only tested one so far.  I tested a damaged window that you 
would never use and it was fine to 500psi.  I am sure they will all test 
fine.  I am also having them buffed first to restore them.  Do you 
need some window by chance.  I have a box full of new windows  that I 
have not even unpacked. 
Hank 

On Saturday, December 7, 2013 4:13:05 PM, 
Land N Sea <landnsea1 at hawaiiantel.net> wrote:

Hank, 
Did you do the testing on your acrylic view ports yet and if so how did 
they do? 

Rick 

From: Douglas Suhr  
Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2013 4:53 PM 
To: Personal 
Submersibles General Discussion  
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] G.L. Summary Stability & 
Buoyancy 

Hank, what are the specs on your new motor?  

On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 8:23 PM, hank pronk <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca> wrote:

Brian, 
>I will be finished the assembly in a few days. I will post a  picture when it is all together. I need the new motor before I can complete  it.   
>Hank 
>
>
>
>On Thursday, December 5, 2013 6:17:06 PM, brian  <brian at ojaivalleybeefarm.com>  wrote:
> 
>It would be nice to see a schematic of this assembly or a picture since  I'm not really grasping what is going on with the seal and bearing  assembly.
>
>Brian
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: "hank pronk" <hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca>
>Sent 12/5/2013 11:12:31 AM
>To: "Personal Submersibles 
  General Discussion" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] G.L. Summary Stability & 
  Buoyancy
>
>
>Vance, 
>Funny you mention the inner tube.  I did just that as an  experiment on my red sphere sub.  I even painted the inner tube white so  it would blend in better.   
>I took a big leap of faith this morning, I just finished machining  the prop shaft bushing housing.  The housing has a bearing and seals  now.  I drilled in two ports (1/8 pipe) to fill and drain the oil.   I like it much better and I have to drain the oil regularly in the second  shaft housing anyways.   
>I also decided to buy a new motor instead of using the  original.  I am driving to the USA tomorrow to pick it up.  That was  my Christmas present. :-)    I am very easy to shop for  :-) 
>Hank  
>
>
>
>On Thursday, December 5, 2013 10:47:14 AM, "vbra676539 at aol.com" <vbra676539 at aol.com> wrote:
> 
>Which suggests a big inner tube if you want to convert a DW2000 to that  definition. Otherwise, keep the door shut, or prepare to swim.  
>Vance
>
>
>
>-----Original  Message-----
>From: Phil Nuytten <phil at philnuytten.com>
>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>Sent: Thu, Dec 5, 2013 11:11 am
>Subject: Re: 
  [PSUBS-MAILIST] G.L. Summary Stability & Buoyancy
>
>
>The minimum hatch to waterline measure applies to those submersibles  ‘intended to be entered while afloat’ -  
>Phil 
>
>
>From: Jon  Wallace  
>Sent: Thursday, December 05, 2013 7:33 AM 
>To: Personal  Submersibles General Discussion  
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] G.L. Summary Stability &  Buoyancy 
> 
>
>I think the first sentence is key, "Submersibles will be 
  assigned Class only after it has been demonstrated that their buoyancy and 
  their static and dynamic stability in in tact condition is adequate FOR THE 
  SERVICE INTENDED".  Some of the lack of specificity is because they can't 
  conceive of every possible application.  They do however have quite a few 
  specifics as you outlined.  Some of the testing won't apply (ie fuel 
  load) and it's possible that a narrow scope of service might lower number of 
  tests required.
>
>
>On 12/5/2013 4:08 
  AM, Alan James wrote:
> 
>
>>
>>I'm afraid there is nothing simple in this section. It is lacking in a  lot of specifics. 
>>There are statements such as "shall generally meet the standard  defined 
>>in the following unless special operational restrictions reflected in  the class 
>>notification allow a lower level. & ...Depending on the type of  submersible & the  
>>operation area, the distance between the waterline in fully surfaced  condition 
>>and the upper edge of entrance openings, air pipes,etc. which may be  open 
>>for surfaced operation, has to be approved by G.L. 
>>   ABS has a minimum distance from the waterline to the hatch  opening of 30" 
>>whereas G.L. states; For surfaced; a minimum distance between  metacentric height & center of gravity of 10cm. (4") And for  submerged, a minimum distance between center of buoyancy & center of  gravity of 5cm (2") (same as ABS). At no stage will G be above B. (including  after dropping the drop weight) 
>>In the initial paper work sent before  construction, a detailed analyses of stability is to 
>>be included.  This  takes the form of analyzing the heeling levers of 10 different load cases in  fresh & salt water, 6 on the surface &  4 submerged & at 6 different heeling 
>>angles. So  looks like 120 calculations. Heeling forces from  free liquid surfaces, turning circles, wind, ice loads, transference of  equipment & personal & payloads from working devices have to be  considered. 
>>There  needs to be sufficient ballast to keep a minimum of 10% of the  pressure 
>>hull out  of the water. The draught line has to be marked on the hull.  
>>When one  major ballast tank is damaged the hatch has to be able to open  without 
>>water  coming in & the heeling angle shouldn't exceed 22,5 
degrees. 
>>There is  an operational in water test at the end of construction with  evaluation 
>>of the  center of gravity upon which the pre build calculations were  based. 
>>Alan 
>>
>> 
>>
>> 
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>> 
>>
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