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Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] open source scrubber design



Cliff,
 
I noticed in your post below that you mentioned "30 lbs of Sodasorb = 80 hours of life support for one man" What internal volume are you basing that on?
 
Rick

Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2011 10:13 AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] open source scrubber design

Cliff,
 
1. My first thought was to split the total amount of Sodasorb into two identical canisters, but then it occurred it might cut operating costs to have one smaller canister adequate for most missions and a second larger canister (sealed) plumbed in for longer missions and long term life support.  That way you're not having to dump as much unused Sodasorb.
 
2. In sizing canisters for one and two person subs, is there some relatively constant ratio between diameter and length, or should the variability just be in the length of the canisters (constant diameter) when designing for various capacities?
 
3. What size canister(s) are you contemplating for your next design?
 
I like the complete redundancy Alan referenced on the DW2000, but accessible space can get short in a hurry in very small subs.  Thanks for your comments.
 
Jim
 
In a message dated 3/13/2011 1:40:12 P.M. Central Daylight Time, cliffordredus@sbcglobal.net writes:
Emile
 
When I build my boat, I to did some investigation into commercially available scrubber systems that would be applicable for a one man psub.  I did not find any that were economically viable. While I agree with Leander that fundamentally the scrubber is not complicated, to make an efficient and practical scrubber takes some work.  I went through several iterations on mine.  One of the key items is, as you mention, the fan.  ABS requires 72 hours of emergency life support after your primary mission time and this has to be able to run off the emergency battery bank.  If you under size the fan to minimize the power requirement to the fan,  then the fan can not generate sufficient differential pressure across the fan to circulate the contaminated air.  This is particularly true if you use an axial flow fan rather than a radial centrifugal fan.  Axial fans are commonly installed on most PC computers.  They are designed for high flow rate but low head.  I made the mistake of using an axial flow fan on my first iteration of my scrubber.  While it would last 80 hours ( the current load is very small), the scrubber effectiveness was not great probably because the blades very stalling.  My initial CO2 level would start at about 350 ppm but would build to 5000 ppm (0.5 mole %) over 30 minutes.  My second iteration replaced the axial fan with a small radial centrifugal fan (squirrel cage) which developed four times the head at about 1/4 of the flow rate.  The current demand was only slightly higher. This worked great while still meeting the low current requirment.
 
The scrubber absorbent choice to me is a no brainier.  Sodasorb HP is what is used most often these days for psubs and re-breathers for divers. It is easy to get and not very expensive.   From a design perspective, after sorting out the fan, it comes down to how do want to handle the storage of the emergency Sodasorb.  There are three options, 1) cartridges for the primary and emergency absorbent, 2) scrubber sized to hold the primary and emergency absorbent 3) scrubber sized for the primary absorbent and spare Sodasorb stored in bulk requiring refill when primary absorbent becomes saturated. There are advantages and disadvantages to each technique.  While cartridges are easy to replace  in an emergency situation, the spare cartridges don't pack as efficiently as bulk  absorbent.  For a small psub like mine, this rules them out; I just did not have the room. I note that  the Deepworker uses the option 2) .  For small one man psubs, I think option 2 is probably the best way to go.  The disadvantage to this approach is that for non emergency conditions, you end of tossing a lot of partially used Sodasorb after each dive.  For a one person sub, this is not an issue but for more than one, this makes this option not as attractive.  Also, because it is inexpensive, this is not a big deal for a one person sub.  This option provides the least stress in a stressful emergency as the operator does not have to worry about changing out the absorbent when it becomes saturated.  On my boat, I use option 3 primarily because of the storage issue.  On my next one person boat, I would go with option 2.  Replacing 30 lbs of Sodasorb (80 hours of life support for one man) is not a big deal given that it simplifies life.
 
While the manufactures of  these absorbents add a chemical that turns the absorbent a different color than white when it becomes saturated, this is not very practical to use as lighting in subs make it hard to detect the color change.  A better detection of a saturated absorbent is a good CO2 sensor with an audible alarm. 
 
So to me, it comes down to correctly specifying the fan and how to package the spare absorbent. 
 
Cliff