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Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] scrubbers



Hi, Vance!
Yeh, she hit the ocean last week - the new 5 hp thrusters worked great - we're using 6 thrusters - 2 laterals (fore and aft) so our fave Dutchman can nose right up to the shear drop-offs and do specimen collecting even though there's a fair current running along the faces. Man, 30 horsepower - if they were all going the same way, you'd be able to water-ski ! (well, almost) - and these are are 5 bollard-pull hp! not the usual imput horse power that most of the thruster people advertise - and give you about 60% of that in actual!
So we're just doing the final paint and various tiddling up and will ship to Curacao next thursday. Then we start on the Exosuits- a couple for delivery January 2011! Oh, Me!
Regards
Phil
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, June 13, 2010 11:12 PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] scrubbers

Launched? At last!!!
Vance



-----Original Message-----
From: Phil Nuytten <phil@philnuytten.com>
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Sent: Mon, Jun 14, 2010 2:07 am
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] scrubbers

Alan:
In the DW2000, only one scrubber is used at a time - it has about 40 hours before bed breakthrough. We advocate splitting the LS system into two discrete and separate systems - right from separate 02 bottles, reducers,fixed steady-flow orifice, bellows-add system, gauges (hp and lp) to separate Co2 scrubbers - that way, one whole system can go out and you still have 40 hours of LS.
    We have monitored Co2 levels in DW and they are significantly below the allowable levels of any agency recommendations. 
 
We use 10 of these scrubbers in the newly launched 'Curasub'! 
Phil
--- Original Message -----
From: Alan James
Sent: Sunday, June 13, 2010 7:52 PM
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] scrubbers

To All,
While looking at various papers on CO2 scrubbers from manufacturers
etc, I found that none addressed the unique situation found in submarines.
Most CO2 absorbent is used in anesthetic machines or rebreathers where
there is a closed circuit. The CO2 breathed out goes straight into the scrubber
& is removed.
In our subs the CO2 is breathed out & is diluted by the rest of the air in the
hull & only air with a portion of the CO2 in the hull goes through the scrubber.
This means that the CO2 level & the pressure in the hull will progressively climb
unless the volume of air going through the scrubber is large enough to make an
impact. The Deep Worker 2000 has fans pushing 160 liters per minute, I'm not
sure whether this is per scrubber & whether they have 2 scrubbers working
simultaneously. But based on 1 fan going, that's 320 x the volume of CO2 being
produced. In the manufacturers guidelines for scrubbers they recommend that the flow
is at least equal to the tidal volume of your breath (about 10 liters per minute)
& low enough so that the air has at least 1/2 a second dwell time in the canister.
This could be 32 x less than what Phil has worked out is necessary for the
Deep Worker. I know the Deep Worker has a small hull & that fluctuations in O2
& CO2 are more critical than a K250, but possibly the same volume of flow is
necessary to achieve atmospheric control in larger subs.
Also because of the dwell time needed the large flow required would need large or
long canisters. Deep Worker has 2x 3.35 kg scrubbers.
On the psub site there is reference to rebreather cartridges as an option, but from
what I've found you would probably need a number of these running simultaneously
to make head way.
What are ABS recommendations? & what are others thoughts / experiences with this.
I'm trying to sort this stuff out for myself.
Regards Alan