Correction: I was referring to the Seehunde, the Biber
was an even greater death trap. The design was abandoned and the Germans
moved on to the Seehunde.
R/Jay
Respectfully,
Jay K. Jeffries
Andros Is., Bahamas
Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish.
- Euripides (484 BC - 406 BC)
From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org] On Behalf Of Jay K.
Jeffries
Sent: Monday, August 11, 2008 5:59 AM
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Restoring a Biber (or Beaver) midget submarine
Brent,
If you read the operational reports on Biber ops you will find
that extend trips by the submersibles were very trying on the crew if not
deadly. The submersible usually operated awash, engine fumes often
overcame the crew, amphetamines were required for the crew (1 and 2 day ops),
dive control was spotty, VERY cramped for space, etc. Very few if any successful
attacks were accomplished, in most cases the sub just disappeared…they
were death traps.
R/Jay
Respectfully,
Jay K. Jeffries
Andros Is., Bahamas
Talk sense to a fool and he calls you foolish.
- Euripides (484 BC - 406 BC)
From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org] On Behalf Of Brent
Hartwig
Sent: Monday, August 11, 2008 3:15 AM
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Restoring a Biber (or Beaver) midget
submarine
You gave me an idea Ray. Say
some one wanted to make a practical modern PSUB replica of the Biber subs. The
large torpedoes could be battery pods with a large thruster in the end of end
one. This along with the diesel motor in the rear of the main pressure
hull, would give the craft great range. The elongated conning tower is a
tricky one. I see advantages in having the extra space, but if not designed
properly, it could be problematic. The RV Needlefish's conning tower
configuration always worried me, not having stiffeners along it's length and/or
between the pilot and passenger, as well as having the conning tower saddled
over the main pressure hull.
http://web.archive.org/web/20051030124733/giffordmarineinc.com/sub/Sub_1_15_02/Image5.jpg
http://web.archive.org/web/20060221073206/www.giffordmarineinc.com/sub/Sub_1_15_02/sub_1_15_01.htm
With Biber's conning
tower being flanged out and then riveted on, that could perhaps be hard to
replicate exactly for some of us. But if your not looking for an exact replica,
I'm sure this group could figure out a strong modern alternative. Right off the
bat, I think of welding on a saddle support like is on the older K-250's like
mine and adding ornamental rivets. Then of course add the same two
longitudinal external flanges to the conning tower to support it's length, as
was done on the originals. We also have the added advantage of using modern
steels, like A516 Gr 70. Then the elongated vertical portion of the
conning tower could be installed like the K-250's and K-350's with the vertical
portion protruding down into the main pressure hull.
Also the main pressure
hull skin, could be thicker in the conning tower section.
Didn't the Biber's have
a VBT? How was the gas stored?
Regards,
Brent
Hartwig
Date: Wed, 6 Aug 2008 11:05:13 -0700
From: psubs2001@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Restoring a Biber (or Beaver) midget submarine
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
|
Hi Brent,
The Biber always seemed to be a practicle size
and layout for a really handy psub. Just add a VBT and change the engine from
petrol (gasoline) to diesel.
We have a few of pictures on the PSUBS web site about the German Biber
(Beaver) at the Royal Navy Submarine Museum at Gosport, England. The article mentioned
Gosport so it must be the same sub.
I see the Museum link has gone missing from the site. I was able to find it
at:
http://www.psubs.org/museum/gosport_biber.html
Also we have both interior and exterior pictures of the HMS Aliance,
X-24 and Italian Maiale at Gostport. For a general link to all the museum
pages go to:
http://www.psubs.org/museum/
Regards,
Ray
--- On Thu, 7/31/08, Brent Hartwig <brenthartwig@hotmail.com>
wrote:
From: Brent Hartwig
<brenthartwig@hotmail.com>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Restoring a Biber (or Beaver) midget submarine
To: "PSUBSorg" <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Date: Thursday, July 31, 2008, 9:12 AM
"After an immense amount of work, along with
help from technical experts at Fleet Support Limited in Portsmouth, at last
the Biber is restored. After 60 years on dry land, rescue pilot Tom Heron
takes our submarine beneath the waves again, while Heinz Huebler watches from
the shore. It is the only working Second World War submarine in the world."
http://www.channel4.com/science/microsites/S/salvage_squad/machines/sub/index.html#4
I would like to see larger versions of the pictures shown on this web
page.
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