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Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub plans

To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub plans
From: irox <irox@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2008 22:16:56 -0800 (GMT-08:00)
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Reply-to: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Sender: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Hi Clive,

thanks for filling us in on your sub specs.

I'm also working towards a similar submarine. 200tons-ish,
18meters-ish, comfortable on longer voyages, etc..

For a while I was planning on a manipulator arm on the bow.
But after thinking about all the different situations I might
want to recover something, I decided that an ROV would be a better
option.  I don't want to risk the crew and submarine, endanger
of entanglement, being near unstable structures, hard to
maneuver/tight spots, etc..  So I plan to have an ROV I can
deploy from the submerged submarine which can have a manipulator
arm.  If I want to investigate something outside of the
operational depth of the submarine, I can just upgrade my
ROV, much cheaper than replacing the submarine.

There are a lot of engineering/design consideration for this, such
as spooling out/in the cable, cable cutters if you need to ditch the ROV,
and an ROV lock out if you want to recover items while submerged.

As for the engine and heat.  A submarine doesn't have much desk
space, so plan to spend most time on long voyages below desk.
This is going to more comfortable if you remove as much heat
as possible before it's in the air.  From a safety point of view
I would like to run will all hatches closed (a bad weather
consideration).  I'm concerned about getting ride of the heat
from the engine block with a water cooled engine, but this be
separate from main living space, so hopefully won't have to
so some extra engineering to do.

Some earlier designs I played with had a diesel engine in a
pod, but after much thinking (and a few people telling me
so and explaining their point of view), I firm believe it's
import to have the engine in a fully accessible part of the
boat so it can be worked on without any problems.

Cheers,
 Ian.

-----Original Message-----
>From: Clive Wood <pirate@arach.net.au>
>Sent: Feb 25, 2008 7:39 PM
>To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub plans
>
>Gday Carsten.
>The thoughts I came up with regarding the use of an air cooled engine 
>are,keeping to a minimum the piping through the pressure hull and therefore 
>eliminating a number of shut off valves, and with internal air ducting to 
>the conning tower this provides a very effective means of changing the total 
>volume of air in the sub,
>An alternative to this would be to locate the engine in an external pressure 
>pod that could be kept automatically at the pressure the sub is operating 
>at.
>This would eliminate heat within the interior of the sub and create a lot 
>more living space.It goes without saying that an aircooled engine is much 
>lighter than water cooled, does not have the problem of heat exchangers for 
>fresh/saltwater cooling  and reduces corrosion of the block.
>As I said before at this stage these are just thoughts and the more feedback 
>I get the more I learn,and if you have any ideas I would be grateful.
>Thanks again
>Clive
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: <MerlinSub@t-online.de>
>To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
>Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 5:51 AM
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub plans
>
>
>Air cooled diesel? why?
>
>regards Carsten
>
>
>"Clive Wood" <pirate@arach.net.au> schrieb:
>> Gday again Ian.
>> At the moment I am just in the thinking phase prior to design phase, these
>> are my thoughts to date.
>> Built as a yacht that can be lived on for periods up to about one month 
>> with
>> 6 persons on the surface.
>> An endurance of 24 hours underwater for 6 persons with emergency air and
>> power for 5 days.
>> Air cooled diesel (surface) and 4 x 72 volt electric motors (submerged).
>> 40 inch acrylic hemispherical viewport in the bow for pilot and 4 x 10 
>> inch
>> viewports for observers and C S television astern and above.
>> A manipulator arm at the lower bow operated electrically rather than
>> hydraulically.
>> I have no ideas as yet as to the type of batteries that would be most
>> suitable, external saltwater batteries would be interesting but would not
>> deliver anything like the power needed for the main drive etc but may be
>> useful for emergencies and lights etc ( very low power but long life ).
>> Able to fill air tanks while travelling on the surface and with a depth
>> capability of 600 feet.
>> These are just basic ideas at this stage and the reality may be quiet
>> different subject to cost etc but it would cut out the cost of a support
>> ship.
>> A friend of mine who builds ROV's as a hobby and myself have an interest 
>> in
>> marine salvage and this is the purpose the sub will be used for.
>> Well I will leave it at that for now and see what ideas I get back.
>> Cheers Clive.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "irox" <irox@ix.netcom.com>
>> To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2008 2:32 PM
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub plans
>>
>>
>> >
>> > Hi Clive,
>> >
>> > welcome to the list!
>> >
>> > I don't know of any available plans for a 4 to 6 person submarine.  Most
>> > of
>> > the plans I've seen are 1 or 2 person (K250, K350, some ambient subs).
>> > You
>> > may have to look at adapting existing ideas/plans or starting from the
>> > ground up.
>> >
>> > Tell us more about how you think you'd be using it? Salt water or lake?
>> > ambient or 1ATM?  Wet or Dry? etc.
>> >
>> > Cheers!
>> >  Ian.
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> >>From: Clive Wood <pirate@arach.net.au>
>> >>Sent: Feb 22, 2008 11:31 PM
>> >>To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>> >>Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub plans
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Gday all,
>> >>Was just wondering if anyone had a set of plans for a four to six person
>> >>submarine. I am thinking of having a go at building one as a retirement
>> >>hobby. I live in Australia and do not have unlimited funds so I was
>> >>wondering if anyone had a set of plans that they did not require anymore
>> >>or could let me have a copy of. An electronic set of plans would be 
>> >>great.
>> >>I am an ex British seaman and would like to get back in the water again.
>> >>Thanks in anticipation,and I might add this is a great forum.
>> >>Regards Clive Wood
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
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