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Carsten you made me think of a important
safety item. If a live aboard submarine gets caught in a bad storm and/or
a rough but not really dangerous storm that last for a very very long time, to
the point you need to surface to recharge your batteries with a diesel system.
Having batteries you can charge quickly so you can resubmerge to a more
comfortable place would be a great advantage. Also if you are using your
diesels at times only to charge your battery banks and/or you are receiving
electricity from a renewable source, such as solar, wind, or water turbines,
your batteries might not be able to take in all the electricity that is
available at any given time. This means your throwing away energy. So
having a battery system that can take in what ever energy is available to it
will make you more efficient. In the case of the diesel systems generating your
electricity it's also important to make sure your alternator size is optimized
to be able to take in as much power from the engine and covert it to electricity
as it can. This way you can acquire as much electricity out of each
gallon of diesel fuel that you can. For some of the larger diesel
engines it might be a good idea to have more then one
alternator.
Regards,
Brent
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 9:16
AM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Valence
Epoch Li-ion Full-size Battery/ Hyman G. Rickover
Hi Peter, I am not agree completly.
I calculate my
diver scooter with Lipoly instead lead acid and
comes of 4 hours instead
of 1. And run 15% faster.
And also One Man Peppers will increase his
underwater endurance four times.
Or in this case much better: two times
and much more payload.
The Euronaut runs 500 miles on the surface with
the diesel and some 20 miles
underwater with the Lead/Gel. Or some 80 -
100 miles underwater with a set of Lipoly.
In other words - you can
increase the underwater range a lot with the new batteries.
No the overall
range. If you want a long range boat build a diesel.
But imagine a
boat made from concret runs 9 knots in 1000 meter deep for some hundred
seamiles.
This can be not done with a diesel and lead acid.
Only with
fuelcell or Lipoly or other high tec battery systems.
The future is
Li/Poly or or Li/Ion or Li/Something with a strong electric main motor
and
a big dieselgenerator set to reload them fast during surface.
The lack of good batteries is still the most problem on
submarines.
If I had to build the Euronaut complete new - with
start from today - I would build a boat
with 2,0 Meter diameter instead of
2,5 meter - and with Li/pols or Li/something batt.
v.b.regrads
Carsten The Li-Phos have only 2 times lead acid capacity but the Li-Poly
have 4 times.
"Peter Madsen" <peter@submarines.dk> schrieb:
>
Sirs,
>
> Definetly "worth following" - but let me just ask - why
do we like improwed
> batteries ?
>
> Lead acid batteries
are old facion, they are heavy and energy content is
> low. These new
batteries are - perhaps less heavy, and the energy content is
> still
quite low.
>
> My point is - that noting in the imagineble future
of batteries will ever
> come close to giving us an electric submarine
with a range to transit to and
> from ofshore dive sites in the facion
that a diesel - electric boat can do.
> I am instaling a 1.5 ton
battery in UC-3 - costing a fortune - and it gives
> me less than an
hour of the output of the dieselengine - that uses about 12
> liters of
fuel pr. hour. Meaning 1500 kg lead acid = 10 kg dieselfuel. If
> the
super Li-ion comes - and stops exploding and gets economicly
>
accesseble - the figures may be 750 kg battey = 10 kg dieselfuel. Electric
> endurance only still is very limeted. Part two - I enjoy the waste
heat from
> the diesels - electric boats tend to be quite cold.
>
> Worth following, yes ofcause, but this is not the answer to range as
such.
> Only Adm. H. Rickovers politically chritical system and the
good old diesels
> can do that.
>
> Some hover manufator
of the 1950ies clamed that in the next decade ( the
> 60ies ) most
hovers for home use would be nuclear powered - so no need for a
> wire.
If anybody here knows where I can get a few of those hovers !!!
>
> Best regards,
>
> Peter Madsen
>
>
>
----- Original Message -----
> From: Cliff Redus
> To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>
Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 2:10 AM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST]
Valence Epoch Li-ion Full-size Battery
>
>
>
Brent,
>
> These Valence Technology Epoch Li-Phosphate batteries
look interesting to me
> as a way to increase battery capacity
and life as compared with AGM
> batteries I am now using.
In my boat I use ten 12V AGM batteries each rated
> at 100 Ah that
weigh 65 lbs each for my main battery pack. They make a
> model
E27 which has the same form factor as the batteries I am using that
>
has a capacity of 122 Ah and weighs only 41 lbs. As an example as a
direct
> replacement in my boat I would get 22% more capacity with a
weight reduction
> of 37% for the same 10 batteries. I can use
the same onboard battery
> charger as I use for my AGM batteries and if
you believe the manufacturer,
> have a cycle life 2000. The
manufacturer does not say anything about
> venting gases during
charging. With a 2-3 hour charge time, this would
> significantly
reduce the turn around time between dives for my boat. It
> will
be interesting to see what they sell for when they go on sale in March
> of 2008. There battery management unit also looks
interesting as it will
> feed SOC data directly into my onobard PLC.
This new battery technology is
> worth following.
> Cliff
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Brent
Hartwig <brenthartwig@hotmail.com>
>
To: PSUBSorg <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
>
Sent: Tuesday, January 1, 2008 6:11:42 AM
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST]
Valence Epoch Li-ion Full-size Battery
>
> This is the third
generation product we can look forward to.
>
>
> http://www.valencecom/assets/pdf/evs_faq.pdf
>
>
> Regards,
> Brent Hartwig
>
>
> --
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