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Hi Brent,
I cannot comment on most items that you mentioned in your
humourous email. As an industrial painting contractor I can assure you that
silica sand from sandblasting DOES NOT cause fisheyes. These are sometimes
caused be silicone contamination. While it does sound similar it in totally
unrelated to the blasting process. If the fisheyes are connected with the
blasting process, it is almost always a result of oil contamination. Almost all
compressors large enough to do sandblasting will emit some oil during normal
operation. This is minimized in several ways
1. Have a larger than essential air compressor - the higher percentage of
capability is used - the worse this condition will be
2. All screw type compressors and most piston compressors use an air/oil
separator, if this separatior is not in good condition it will add to this
problem
3. To do high quality blasting, it is best to use an aftercooler. Large
compressors generate a great deal of heat and can carry a great deal of water
because of
the temperature. This water carrys with microcopic amounts of oil. When
the air leaves the nozzle pressure and temperature decrease quickly and the
air
cannot
hold the level of moisture that it was previously capable of holding. The result
is what settles on your work.
I have oversimplified to conserve space, but I do hope
that it helps.
Best Regards,
Jim Kocourek
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2007 12:50
PM
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Real Live
Submerge Testing on a 12 Volt Lawnmower Battery
Thanks Peter and
Carsten,
That makes
me want to do more test. What should I do next? How deep can a
PSUB go into a bubble bath before it melts? Does yellow paint make one
crazy? Will metal glue guns revolt if painted pink? Do goldfish in a fish bowl
like being underwater in a submarine with a black interior? Will my sweetheart
forgive me if I buy view ports instead of house windows? Can a Night Rider
KITT car replica be made into an ambient
submersible?
What am I
going to do tonight, the same thing I do every night, try to take over the
world. ; )'
So far the
mower is just fine and started right up again this
morning.
How would
chlorine enter the cells? Like I used to say when I was commercially raising
parrots. Nothing a gallon of bleach and a pressure washer can't
fix.
Anyways I
forgot to mention that the battery never got warm will doing this
testing.
I did do a
test on some acrylic scraps. If you wipe it with MEK, it will instantly craze
the surface.
Also I
just heard that sandblasting with silica sand gives painters trouble later
with, what is called fisheyes (bubbles) in the paint, since the silica can
permeate the metals surface.
Regards,
Brent
Hartwig
From: peter@submarines.dk
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject:
Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Real Live Submerge Testing on a 12 Volt Lawnmower
Battery
Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2007 09:09:30 +0200
Hurrah !
Finally a person who understands the value of
experimentation. No more worried grandma´s - batteries are not bombs
initiated by seawater nor electric chairs ready to electrocute
submariners.
- Do expect that if any chloride has entered the cells
the lawnmower will be in trouble soon.
Best regards, and applause...
Peter Madsen
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2007 7:28
AM
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Real Live
Submerge Testing on a 12 Volt Lawnmower Battery
Well Boys and Girls, I did some
testing.
Ya I
know that usually means vacate the area with or without your shorts, to
another county. But it's to late, I already did it. One can talk about it
for only so long before they get off there arss and get dirty. It's more
fun to.
So I
removed a fully charged 12 volt lawn mower battery, I could do with out
until next week, if it blow up anyways, and I did some testing. I
then obtained a five gallon bucket, jumper cables, lots of protective
clothing, and a full face shield, among other things. I then put the
battery in an empty bucket and then put the end of the hose into it. Then
I remotely filled the bucket with slightly hard freshwater, I don't
remember what the PH of my water is. Nothing happened, or at least that's
what I thought at first. I then removed the water and battery from
the bucket and attached jumper cables to it in the normal fashion. When
striking the ends of the cables together I got the normal sparks. When I
put them underwater there was some weak hydrogen production from the
negative lead. Then when I touched the leads together underwater, I got
the same basic spark as I did out of the
water.
Then I
went and found my old stash of
aquarium stuff, and pulled out some Instant Ocean brand sea salt and mixed
it in freshwater, until I got a specific gravity of 1.21, like most sea
water. I then removed the freshwater from the bucket and added the
saltwater for some more testing. I tested the leads in the same way
and got the same result, but with a bit more hydrogen production from the
negative lead.
Next I
added enough salt into the one gallon in the bucket to make three gallons
of sea water, so I could completely submerge the battery. But before I
added the water I mixed in the salt and tested the leads again.
Now when I put the leads into
the water on either side of the inside of the bucket, the negative lead
produced allot more hydrogen. When I then touched the two leads under
water there was a larger spark on the tangent surfaces and they tried to
stick together. They didn't try to stick together in freshwater and not
much in normal sea water. Point is that if you take your sub to the
Great Salt Lake in Utah be careful.
Now I
added two more gallons of freshwater to the mix, to get a specific gravity
of 1.21 again, and put in the battery remotely. Nothing much happened,
just some hydrogen production from the negative pole. This was just a
cheap normal battery, not a AGM sealed type. I then did some testing and
then put my bare finger in the water. Nothing, not even a tingle. I then
lowered the level of the water to about an inch over the top of the poles.
Then did some more testing and then put my finger directly between the
poles, nothing.
I then
removed the salt water and refilled it with freshwater and did the same
testing, nothing. I would say that the battery would of slowly discharged
by producing hydrogen until spent. No explosion when submerged in
this way. The hydrogen in an enclosed space would be real bad news. You'll
be safer in freshwater then salt since you'll have more time to get out
before the hydrogen levels get to high. Still you better get out ASAP
unless you can route the hydrogen into your AIP unit quickly. ;
)'
Finally I reinstalled the battery in the mower and started
the mower with no trouble. I learned allot from doing this, how about you?
Just remember I'm a submarine half full kind of
guy.
Here
are my pictures of the submerged battery
testing.
http://www.frappr.com/?a=viewphoto&id=4001713&pid=7357670
Regards,
Brent
Hartwig
"Do or
do not, There is no
try"
~ Yoda
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