RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] On the subject of "passengers"...

Karl Stanley's Idabel submersible, regularly goes down below 2000 FSW with passengers, so in that regard he's got most if not all of use beat hands down. Of course going that deep and being far more then 60 feet from shore, it's a very serious dive to under take with regards to passenger safety. I would suspect that one reason Karl took Idabel to Roaton, Honduras was because they don't require ABS rules. The other main reason was very deep water, very close to shore, with great critters to see. That's not to say that he didn't build Idabel to be a very safe craft. Besides remember "Amateurs build the Ark, Professionals built the Titanic.". Which one would you like to take a world cruise on?

Brent

From: "Peter Madsen" <peter@submarines.dk>
Reply-To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] On the subject of "passengers"...
Date: Fri, 20 Jul 2007 23:28:58 +0200

Dear Psubbers,

From time to time - people mention diving with people for a fee. The Nemo submersible does it -

To Dive does it - Karl Stanley's deep sea boats does it - and both Freya and Kraka does it.

If you sell "tickets" there is no doubt that it will violate IMO rules on the regulation of tourist submersibles, plus

local maritime authorities regulations. In most cases no insurance will cover in case of accidents or death - and

as the responsible captain or pilot of the submersible you take on a very big responsibility. Most ordinary people

will have no chance or ability to evaluate your ships safety features - or overall design. In this sense the passengers

are completely in the hands of the submarine pilot.

When we have guest on our sub here in Copenhagen - they join a club - no ticket. They are informed that this is an

experimental craft, and that diving in it is dangerous. They are carefully instructed in the ships emergency procedures and

equipment. They are instructed in how the surface the boat in the case of the pilot getting decapasitated. The dive is

executed at less than 30 feet of water, and at less than 60 feet from shore. It is done in an area with no other surface traffic.

We cunduct safety drills at regular intervals - testing if the instructions works and if our members in fact can safe the ship

with a dead pilot - and if they can get on emergency breating apparatus...and we have even trained exiting the boat via the diver

lockout while its was landed on the seabed - simulating an entanglement emergency.

However - despite all training - nobody can ever claim to be good a handling a real submarine emergency since very few have tried

one for real.

The fees - in the form of contingent in our club - is used exclusively for the maintenance of the boat, and for our workshop -

and nobody makes money for them selves via this activity. In this way - we claim ist not a comercial activety.

After more the one thousand dives with no injury, accidents or casualties - I feel this is reasonably safe - and still I try

never to get calm - any dive may be the "big one" - where our training - equipment and nerves will decide just how big -

or bad it comes out.

I just wish to say that those of you who use your psubs together with "non psubbers" like I do - always remember your

responsibilities - and let your guest know what they are doing - and what to do in the case of a problem.

I am now ready to resive tomatoes - rotten eggs - or public hanging for my mentioning of this...:o)

Begging for mercy,

Peter

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