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RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Diver lockout VBT

To: <personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Diver lockout VBT
From: "Jay K. Jeffries" <bottomgun@mindspring.com>
Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 12:42:22 -0400
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In-reply-to: <1Hryet-2CVxMu0@fwd34.sul.t-online.de>
References: <1Hryet-2CVxMu0@fwd34.sul.t-online.de>
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Carsten,
The divers experienced a lot of difficulties and my hat is off to them for
what they accomplished through perseverance.  There were numerous cases of
the subs broaching or plunging to the bottom during diver operations that
dragged the divers with them.  Most of these are not noted in the general
literature as the history is written to be heroic.
R/Jay


Respectfully,
Jay K. Jeffries
Andros Is., Bahamas

A skimmer afloat is but a submarine, so poorly built it will not plunge.


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org] On Behalf Of
MerlinSub@t-online.de
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2007 11:59 AM
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Diver lockout VBT

I made a drawing to explain my words.. 

www.euronaut.org/content/upload/notes/AnchorandExit001.jpg

Note - I study the x-craft 
- X-craft have many troubles - mostly electric. 
But the diver exit in mid water works.  

:-) best regards Carsten 


<MerlinSub@t-online.de> schrieb:
> I forgot something. The trunk is below the hatch. I can close the hatch
with a dry chamber any time. Dosen't matter how the waterlevel in the trunk
is. 
> 
> Anchor underwater is simple - just make the boats forward hard tank heavy
with the weight of the anchor. Euronauts anchor is a simple lead bell with
488 pound. 
> Boat is than still neutral but anchor is than with 488 pounds in the mud..

> Realy havy currents are may a problem. 
> 
> best regards Carsten 
> 
> 
> <MerlinSub@t-online.de> schrieb:
> > Gentlemens.. 
> > 
> > The diver exit on Euronaut is on the bottom of the diver chamber. 
> > And has a exit trunk below it. 
> > 
> > If a diver has ready to dive a density of say 1 - there is no
compensating system required except this trunk. 
> > 
> > Say volume of the diver is 1 something and remaining air volume of the
chamber is 10 something. Air pressure is equal to outside pressure and hatch
is open. 
> > 
> > If the Diver leave the chamber the free air volume in the chamber
increase to 11 - right ? - But that means that the air or gas pressure goes
down - and the water from outside climb a little into the trunk until the
chamber volume without the diver is back to 10 - right ? 
> > 
> > The water which climbs into the short trunk has also a density of 1 -
because the diver is neutral in the water - so boat is allways compensate. 
> > 
> > Euronaut trunk is such high that three divers can leave the chamber
before water climb into the chamber.. 
> > 
> > Keep it simple.. :-)
> > 
> > The chain is only there to compensate small differences in water density
and temperature and other small items to compensate - not to compensate a
diver exit !
> > 
> > The boat is on anchor during diver exit about one divers high over the
seabottom - The anchor is 400 pounds heavy.. and the hardtank on top of the
anchor system is flooded to this 400 pound to make the anchor 400 pound
heavy. 
> > 
> > best regards Carsten
> > 
> > 
> > "irox" <irox@ix.netcom.com> schrieb:
> > > 
> > > I don't think 170-200lbs object leaving the sub would be
> > > negligible, the sub would float off with out it.  Carsten
> > > suggested a neat way of dealing with that, having a heavy
> > > chain resting on the sea floor attached to the sub, when I
> > > diver gets out, the sub gets lighter and lifts a link or two
> > > off the sea bed.  Search the archives for Carsten's original
> > > email about this system.
> > > 
> > > Cheers,
> > >  Ian.
> > > 
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > >From: Rob Bryan <Sundiver2000@earthlink.net>
> > > >Sent: May 25, 2007 12:46 PM
> > > >To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org, underseacolonies@yahoogroups.com
> > > >Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Diver lockout VBT
> > > >
> > > >I've no experience with sub lockouts. I would think lockouts while 
> > > >hovering would be very difficult and dangerous, so assuming sitting
on 
> > > >the bottom...
> > > >
> > > >Getting in and out of a vertical hatch with gear on is quite a task, 
> > > >whether scuba or line (with a bailout). In dive bell lockouts, the
bell 
> > > >is flooded a little to make it easier. Wouldn't you do that in a sub 
> > > >lock out? So if the lock was 48" in diameter and you only flooded it
up 
> > > >a foot, that would be 800 lbs. The diver leaving would be negligible,

> > > >no? (this doesn't even include any trunk volume). Is this actually a 
> > > >problem?
> > > >Rob B
> > > >
> > > >ShellyDalg@aol.com wrote:
> > > >> Hi. This is in response to the diver weight compensation question.
> > > >> Every dive trip in your sub requires careful measurement of what
you 
> > > >> bring on-board.
> > > >> If the dive plan calls for a diver to exit the sub while at depth,
I 
> > > >> would think that it would be better to add buoyancy to cover the 
> > > >> divers extra weight while on-board, and then dump that buoyancy (
air 
> > > >> bubble ) when the diver exits the sub, there-by maintaining neutral

> > > >> buoyancy while the diver is outside.
> > > >> When the diver is back on-board, blow the required amount of air
back 
> > > >> into the trim tank ( a measured amount of water to compensate for 
> > > >> exactly how much the diver weighs ) and again maintaining neutral 
> > > >> buoyancy.
> > > >> A sub with a diver lock-out function would need a bigger trim tank 
> > > >> than a sub without that capability.
> > > >> Don't forget to calculate how much air the diver displaces with his

> > > >> body, as this will figure into the required additional buoyancy
too.
> > > >> You don't need a separate pump system, nor would that be desirable,
to 
> > > >> let a diver exit and re-enter the sub. The lock-out chamber is 
> > > >> controlled by air pressure, and any small amount of water that 
> > > >> remained within would be easily compensated for by the additional
trim 
> > > >> tank volume.
> > > >> You WILL need some means of dumping the air from the lock-out
chamber 
> > > >> once the water is blown out and the hatch is closed so the diver is

> > > >> once again  at one atmosphere. This needs to be monitored closely
so a 
> > > >> diver has time to dump the excess nitrogen absorbed by his body 
> > > >> tissues and blood. A diver lock-out chamber is really much like a 
> > > >> de-compression chamber, but is located inside another chamber ( the

> > > >> sub's pressure hull ) so a compressor to drive out the additional
air 
> > > >> is required.
> > > >> Frank D.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >> See what's free at AOL.com 
> > > >> <http://www.aol.com?ncid=AOLAOF00020000000503>.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
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- Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Diver lockout VBT
  - From: MerlinSub@t-online.de
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