Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] No more batts on psubs?

["Paul Kreemer" <paulkreemer@gmail.com>]

:-)   Oh, I saw a mention of the energy densities of "carbon fiber flywheels" versus plain old steel ones.  The composite one was at least several times greater.  For electric cars, or boats, or whatever, I get a kick out of these alternative storage technologies.  Does anyone remember a Popular Science article from long ago where they reviewed using flywheels in cars?  

It seems that we're in a bit of a dark age in terms of electrical storage and like a lot of dreamers I'm looking forward to consumer fuel cells, or ultracapacitors or the next new thing to provide a competitve option to internal combustion engines.


Paul

On 9/27/06, MerlinSub@t-online.de <MerlinSub@t-online.de > wrote:

hi-tech flywheels ?

"Paul Kreemer" < paulkreemer@gmail.com> schrieb:
> To support Andy's post:  the energy density of ultra-capacitors is, sadly,
> lower than that of most chemical batteries.  And lower than hi-tech
> flywheels.  :-)  But it looks like they can provide a nice large pulse,
> beyond what most batteries would.  So I'd guess that's where they'd fit into
> starting systems.
>
>
> According to this industry-produced chart, batteries have 8 to 120 times the
> Watt-hours per kilogram.  I've seen capacitors listed as high as 10 Wh/kg,
> but still...
>
> Energy Density
>
> super cap: 1 to 5 Wh/kg
>
> battery: 8 to 600 Wh/kg
>
> http://www.cap-xx.com/resources/reviews/strge_cmprsn.htm#chart
>
>
>
> Paul
>
> On 9/27/06, Andy Jensen <drewacard@charter.net> wrote:
> >
> > "Supercap energy  is normally measured in watt seconds. There are
> > 3,600,000 watt seconds in a kilowatt hour" -Don  Lancaster
> >
> >
> > Andy
> >
> >
> > ---- Rick and Marcia <empiricus@telus.net> wrote:
> > I suspect the beginning of a long and beautiful thread  ;-)
> >
> >
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > And I quote: "Ultracapacitors have replaced or are being tested to replace
> > batteries in engine starting applications such as . . . submarine engines .
> > . ."
> >
> > No hydrogen emissions, no chemistry at all, no heat emissions, no
> > seawater/battery acid danger (chlorine gas), millions of duty cycles (not ~
> > 700 as with lead acid), one tenth the weight of lead acid batts, equivalent
> > of an 800 km. drive for ~$10 (CDN) . . .
> >
> >
> > Sources:
> >
> > http://thefraserdomain.typepad.com/energy/2006/01/about_supercapa.html
> > http://tyler.blogware.com/blog/_archives/2006/1/19/1715549.html
> >
> > http://money.cnn.com/2006/09/15/technology/disruptors_eestor.biz2/index.htm
> >
> > "The leading suppliers of ultracapacitors include Maxwell Technologies,
> > San Diego, CA, USA; ELIT Co, Kursk, Russia; Joint Stock Company ESMA,
> > Moscow, Russia;  NessCap, Ltd, Yongin, Kyonggi-Do, Republic of South Korea;
> > Cap-XX pty.Ltd, Lane Cove NSW, Australia."
> >
> >
> >
> > Enjoy!!!
> >
> > Rick L
> > Vancouver, Canada
> >
> >
> >
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