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Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Ross's insults
I know that this little tiff is being put to rest, and I'd hate to
bring it up again, because, frankly, I'm upset by BOTH of your posts.
I just need to get this off of my mind.
To start:
Ross,
I used to have VERY similar views that you did on guns. I was brought
up to think guns = bad. I was born and raised in Massachusetts.
Massachusetts is a state that has some strict anti-gun laws. It also
has a pretty high violent crime rate, not just in urban areas. In
Massachusetts, I grew up on the New Hampshire border. New Hampshire
has pretty laid back gun laws. Do you know who has a lower crime rate
in EVERY instance, whether talking about violent crime density,
violent crimes per person, or violent crimes per gun owner? New
Hampshire has the lower violent crime rate in every instance. Another
good example is Washington, D.C. You can't own or carry a gun within
the city limits of D.C. Do you know what city in the US has the
highest murder rate? That's right, it's Washington D.C.
I used to think it was backward logic when a pro-gun enthusiast
claimed that tight anti-gun laws only takes guns away from law-abiding
citizens, but not the criminals. I couldn't prove why it was backward,
but it didn't sound right to me.
Then I found out that as little as 5 miles from my house, in the Great
State of New Hampshire, people leave their houses unlocked on a
regular basis, having never experienced a robbery or anything of the
sort. My street isn't really easy to find, and neither is my house, if
you're searching randomly for a target house to rob. We've had at
least 3 attempts at front-door entries, and one successful break-in
though a rear window. Now, I don't think owning a gun would have done
anything to prevent that. I think living in a state with high gun
ownership would have, and does.
It's been said, I forget by who, that Whomever allows themselves to be
disarmed deserves to be disarmed. Instilling fear in the public,
followed by disarmament are the first things that happen before a
dictatorship climbs to power.
So, Ross, look at numbers. Look at them from MANY sources (because
statistics are indeed easy to twist). I think you'll find that gun
ownership is more beneficial to society as a whole, than it is
detrimental.
And Bill,
"why should I bother to try
and enlighten your liberal self?"
Just because someone is vehemently one-sided on one issue, that
doesn't automatically put them in any political category. I consider
myself a liberal-libertarian, and I'm for gun-ownership. I don't vote
on that issue alone though. I vote on ALL the issues that I'm
passionate about.
So, please, don't make those kinds of assumptions right off.
And two "...except for Kommiefornia
and Minnosota..."
Just call it California. I could go into a lot of detail as to why
communism isn't all that bad, why the McCarthy-ist attitude always was
unnecessary, and why so many lives have been lost because of that very
attitude. But, making a pseudo-political statement while trying to be
"cute"... Just don't do it.
So now that I've argued with both of you, I can go back to napping. I
think we all, you two especially, should apologize to each other, and
agree to disagree.
So, I apologize for bringing it up again. I hope I didn't offend
anyone by sharing my thoughts. I know I probably haven't swayed
anyone's views, but I established where I stand at least. That's where
I stand, and if any of you want to tell me where you stand, on
anything, I'll accept it.
Okay,
Bye.
-Tom D.
On 9/3/06, lakins1@tampabay.rr.com <lakins1@tampabay.rr.com> wrote:
Dear Ross.
I COULD try to explain to you firearms laws and why there is no loophole
here, how I CONFORMED specifically to federal law and all state firearm
laws mirror federal law regarding machineguns except for Kommiefornia
and Minnosota, how it is not even a firearm but an accessory stock you
put your firearm into, how it is not only not a firearm but not a
machinegun, how according to law it is a semi auto accelerated rate of
fire and does not fire fully automatically, the unconstitutional 1934
and 1968 gun control acts, the reason for our 2nd amendment in the first
place, the fact that terrorists are funded by organizations that supply
them with crates of REAL full auto and they have no need for my semi
auto accelerated firing rate accessory stock, the fact that someone can
kill just as many people MORE efficiently with a semi auto as they can
with a full auto, why the 2nd amendment is not about "need", why crime
is about the criminal and not about the weapon he uses. I COULD try to
do that, but since you insulted me for no good reason stating that I am
a "kook" due to my past posts on submarines, why should I bother to try
and enlighten your liberal self? But that isn't the main reason. The
main reason is it is just beneath my dignity to attempt to educate
someone as ignorant and insulting as you are. Along with of course that
this is a forum for subs not firearms. I was just posting a very quick
little note to some of the fellows here I had corresponded with in the
past. A very quick little note from me with two links in it and you
turned it into a flaming controversy that I never intended. I will not
respond at this forum to any more postings regarding this. You are
entitled to your opinion. If you are so afraid of others having it,
perhaps you should purchase one so you can be equally armed. My
satisfaction in your case is that it is perfectly legal in your state. Bill.
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Ross Donato
>To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
>Sent: 9/2/2006 5:57:31 PM
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] The Akins accelerator
>
>
>Bill,
>
>If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, its a duck. You may have
>found a legal loophole allowing you to sell this weapon, but what you've
>done is make a machinegun available to everyone. Whether it's technically
>classified as one or not, anything that fires fully automatic is a
>machinegun. And making it easy for anyone to get a fully automatic weapon,
> especially now that terrorists are a worldwide problem, is a stupid and
>dangerous thing to do.
>
>I went to your website and was shocked by the attitude of your questions
>for potential buyers.
>
>Do you think going shooting is a lot of fun?
> Is ~$10,000 for a full auto 10/22(r) a bit above your budget?
> Do you live in an oppressive state where you can't have full auto?
>
>An oppressive state? Law enforcement officers are fighting for their lives
>against criminals who outgun them. Terrorist groups are working all around
>the world to kill innocent people. You call restrictions on machineguns
>oppressive? Last month here in Hawaii a 14 year old boy took his fathers
>gun to school. It was an Ingram Mac 11 sub machinegun! The father said he
>keeps it around as a conversation piece. I guess he likes to talk about
>killing dozens of people very very quickly. That gun is illegal here, so
>what is he doing with a sub machinegun anyway? Why does he need it? For
>the sick power trip he gets from it? The idea of people walking around
>with machineguns does not make me feel safe at all. The laws restricting
>machineguns is not oppression, it is protection for the rest of us who
>don't want them around our kids, or available to criminals. By your logic,
>the restrictions on atomic bombs or dangerous drugs is oppression, too.
>Man! You need to think abo!
> ut someone other than yourself!
>
> Do you have a full auto 10/22 and just want another cool new toy?
>
>A machinegun is not a toy, Bill. It's a deadly weapon. Your attitude is
>crazy.
>
> Do you live where full auto is legal but the CLEO won't sign the forms?
> Do you find submitting to fingerprints, photos and a $200 tax offensive?
> Are you tired of waiting on the government to process the paperwork?
>
>I guess just about every terrorist, criminal, and bad guy in the world
>would answer yes to these questions. Nice customers you serve.
>
> Are you in a big hurry to put all that lead back into the ground for
>ecology's sake?
>
>That is a bad joke. You obviously don't care about ecology or anything
>else but yourself.
>
>Bill, I've read your messages here for a long while and always felt you
>were some kind of harmless kook. Now, I have to delete the word harmless.
>
>But what does your advertisement here for your deadly invention have to do
>with psubs? Nothing! And how many young people are out there reading
>this? How many of them can be lured by your sales pitch to buy this
>machine gun invention of yours? How many will get it without their parents
>knowledge? How many will be stolen and end up on the black market? How
>many tragedies will your invention cause? Many, and you should have
>thought about that!
>
>Machine guns can't be used for normal hunting. They were invented to kill
>many people very quickly. That is what your invention will help people do,
>and because it's not restricted by laws, your invention will be used by
>psycopaths, criminals and terrorists. Bad, Bill! Bad, bad, bad!
>
>Soon we will hear stories on the news about criminals using your machine
>gun for the wrong purposes. Innocent people will die because of this, mark
>my words. And it's all going to be blood on your hands, Bill. You will
>probably look the other way and only think about the money or the status of
>being a big inventor, but I would not want to be in your shoes on the
>Judgement Day.
>
>Of all the good things you could have spent your time inventing, you chose
>something you can only use to get your kicks shooting things up faster, but
>it will also make it easier for crooks to kill people more easily. And you
>play it off like it's just a toy, and all in fun. I think this is sick.
>Sick, sick, sick!
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Ross Donato, Ewa Beach Hawaii
>
>lakins1@tampabay.rr.com wrote:
>Hi group. Just thought I'd show you what I've been so busy doing. A bit
>off topic but I hope you will forgive me.
>Just paste this into your browser http://firefaster.com/
>and also http://www.acceleratorfan.com/home.htm
>After inventing it 10 years ago and getting my patent in 2000 I'm
>finally marketing it.
>
>Bill Akins.
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