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Hi Cliff.
As the inventor and patent owner of a firearm accessory device I have had
to learn a bit about firearm laws. You are allowed without any license to
manufacture a firearm from scratch FOR YOUR OWN PERSONAL USE, as long as it is
not a restricted
firearm under NFA laws which would be like a rocket launcher or machinegun,
etc. If you planned to manufacturer and market your device you would have
to get a federal firearms manufacturer license as you mentioned.
You may own these NFA (national firearm act) restricted weapons,
machineguns etc, but it requires special registration. So you could legally
make a firearm speargun for your own use Cliff as long as it wasn't a machinegun
and this
would require no special registration at least none in my state of
Florida. Using it with the tangle of local and state laws could be a problem
according to where you lived though.
Imagine building your firearm speargun in Florida and then taking it to New
York (where they have the sullivan act) and trying to dive with it. If they
caught you using it you would be arrested because N.Y. has different laws than
florida
regarding firearms, even though it is a speargun firearm. If you live in a
state with very restrictive firearm laws, (which Florida does not) just play it
safe and build either a rubber powered or air powered speargun.
Kindest Regards,
Bill Akins.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, April 01, 2005 4:39
PM
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Discharging
Batteries
Ditto to checking the laws. I
believe it takes a certain class of Federal Firearms License to manufacture a
firearm from scratch. Any violation of our firearms laws can instantly
terminate your right to EVER own or use one again.
Best Regards,
Cliff
Hi Brian.
I believe you might have misunderstood me. I never said underwater
firearms are illegal per se.
Actually what I said was....."You might run into some legal problems if
you design and use an underwater firearm...."
The reason I said that is because firearms are both federally and state
regulated. They are regulated differently from state to state (I won't EVEN
mention my opinion on that, as everyone breaths a sigh of relief!
Lol.)
Federal law says that any device that is designed to expell a
projectile using the propellent gas force of a chemical reaction explosion,
is a firearm.
I checked with the local coast guard branch and they told me that the
state law of Florida says you have to be at least nine miles out in order to
discharge a
firearm from a boat. I explained to them that I was speaking of
discharging a speargun which by using a cartridge would be technically a
firearm. So in Florida you could use a cartridge
speargun firearm to spearfish if you were at least nine miles
out.
This may not be the same if you are in another state. That is why I
said you MIGHT run into some legal problems using
an underwater firearm. It just depends on how far out you are and
what state you are in, and even what country you are in. Since the laws
differ all over, it would be best to check what your
local laws are before buying, making or using a firearm speargun. Since
air or rubber powered spearguns are not a firearm, using either of them
would not be regulated as a firearm.
They would fall into the same catagory as a BB gun or slingshot.
Remember though that same areas do not even let you use a rubber powered
speargun.
Brian, when Cliff said..... "Once speared, at least in my
experience, most fish dive. The two bars mentioned above will capture
the piston and cause the fish to "ratchet" down to somewhere below the
sub where they will dangle until the sub surfaces and they are manually
captured. Worst case, they flail around above until expired,
eventually sinking through the ratcheting mechanism to dangle
below the sub. I plan to surface after a couple of shots to keep the
sharks from benefiting from all my hard work."
Cliff had mentioned his plans and I assumed already addressed and
overcome entanglement issues and he plans to surface when a couple are
on the line. This isn't to say he might never get snagged on something. The
weight of his P sub might break the line if that
happened though. But it is a concern.
You questioned Brian, of some way to send the fish to the surface
after spearing them with a non line attached free spear, .
I have never used a system like that personally but you can
attach a float that is attached to your speargun line. Some people just
inflate a small baloon to their line. When you spear the fish you detach the
line and the float carries the line to the surface
where it can be picked up. You then attach another ready made line to
your speargun and continue spearing. I know that does not answer your
question of automatic activation of a float for floating a free spear
without a line, but it's all I know. If I find anything that
automatically activates upon a hit and floats a freespear I will be
sure and mention it to you.
Kindest Regards,
Bill Akins.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, April 01, 2005 12:27
PM
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST]
Discharging Batteries
Anyway, that is very interesting that you have thought out some type
of speargun device from a sub.
Since my first realization
that I could actually build a working sub I started thinking about what I
would like to use it for. Research is always an option, but ocean
farming as alway peaked my interest. It's something that is starting
to happen in different parts of the world now on a limited basis.
With sport spearfishing there are limits on how many
fish you can take and what species are in season and so forth. I
personally have only spearfished out at our local islands with a Hawwaian
sling with only mask and snorkle. But what I'm wondering
is., Bill you said that underwater "firearms" are illegal, what it
you shot a air powered spear at a fish that you are going to eat ( not a
protected fish) and the spear is not connected by a cable. ( It seems
like if you had a cable you might be asking for entaglement
problems.) Would it be possible once the spear
penetrated the fish that a small air pladder could be activated which
would send the fish to the surface?
Brian
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005
4:01 PM
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST]
Discharging Batteries
The guns will be "fired" from inside
the sub (charging a pressure reservoir, locking it out, and then
redirecting the air to the "chamber" of the gun), all done with normal
steel pipe and ball valves. A piston located forward of the
chamber will push the spear out of the barrel and between two rods
spaced far enough apart to allow the spear to pass but not the
piston. The key to keeping the spear straight is using one or
more sabots inside the barrel, since the piston will be much bigger than
the spear. The sabots will keep the spear aligned until it exits
the barrel and the piston will push them out to clear the barrel after a
shot (for possible reloading?). A short length of steel cable
is wound around the piston and anchored to it. Once speared,
at least in my experience, most fish dive. The two bars mentioned
above will capture the piston and cause the fish to "ratchet" down
to somewhere below the sub where they will dangle until the sub surfaces
and they are manually captured. Worst case, they flail around
above until expired, eventually sinking through the ratcheting
mechanism to dangle below the sub. I plan to surface after a
couple of shots to keep the sharks from benefiting from all my hard
work. I am pretty sure I can build a gun for about as much as a
decent hand-held pneumatic gun (<$300.00). The motivation for
all this is the idea of spear-fishing at 1Atm for SEVERAL HOURS at a
time with no concern for dive tables, being able to survey a fishing
area without eating into dive time, having the ability to patiently wait
for prey, not worrying about how big a fish is and if I have enough air
to fight it ( I got real stupid once and shot a 35lb
barracuda with little air left in a single tank @ 80ft,
the dive master rightly refused to let me have a second dive that
day), and dramatically increasing the amount and type of fish
caught (provided I get the gun right!!). This type of hunting fits
unbelievably well with a psub. The sub only has to be able to
submerge to certain depths (in my case, about 120' maximum, normally
45-90'), manuever for very short periods of time, and hold a somewhat
stable position for 30 minutes or more (fish are curious, they will come
to you). I've speared most of my fish sitting on cross braces on
oil platforms, trying to conserve air by not swimming around too
much. My son's a commercial diver and he literally has to push
them out of his way when he's doing hull cleanings, prop maintenance,
etc. I think they will flock to a sub, especially if it's "just
sitting there" with a basket of crushed barnacles on top of
it:).
Best Regards,
Cliff
Cliff,
How are you
going to spearfish while you're inside the sub? How will
you retrieve the fish? Are you thinking reeling them back into
next to the ship? I haven't totally figured what type of
spearfishing unit I'm going to use.
Brian
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005
12:04 PM
Subject: RE: [PSUBS-MAILIST]
Discharging Batteries
Good Question. I actually
have a few of reasons. Putting them under the seats gets
them conveniently out of the way but still easily accessible for
change-out (from a support boat), eliminates several cubic
feet of cabin space that would otherwise have to be
displaced by adding more weight, doesn't add to the complexity
of the shape of the pressure hull, and minimizes the amount of
"second skin" that I will have to add to smooth the outside shape
since I intend to spear fish with pneumatic spearguns mounted
on the sub. I don't want fish on steel cables
getting tied up on battery pods, motors, etc. Due to the
distance I have to travel to fish, I have resigned myself to
building a towable sub. For practical reasons it will have to
be as small as possible and somewhat planeable(sp?) when
towed. I think I hit most of the reasons.
Thanks Again for your
Input,
Cliff
-----Original Message-----
From:
owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org
[mailto:owner-personal_submersibles@psubs.org]On Behalf Of
Akins
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2005 1:12
PM
To: personal_submersibles@psubs.org
Subject:
Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Discharging Batteries
Cliff,
Why not just put your batteries outside the cabin in battery
pods? That way you don't have the problem to begin with.
Kindest Regards,
Bill Akins.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, March 29,
2005 3:12 PM
Subject: RE:
[PSUBS-MAILIST] Discharging Batteries
Actually, that's what
prompted my question. I blew a car battery up trying to
jump-start the wife's car. Fortunately, I had been using a
skill-saw in the garage moments before and was still
wearing safety glasses. After a really
fast shower I retrieved the safety glasses and noticed that
they were literally dripping with slimy acid residue, I still
get chills thinking about it. Since this occurred while
attempting to charge the battery, I was under the
assumption that charging was the culprit. Yours is the
first time I've heard of a battery exploding while under
"normal" load. I'll probably go with the AGM batteries and
put some lockable 1/8" steel plate between myself and the
batteries anyway. Not sure what I can do to ventilate the
gases in the event of an explosion, I was planning to shut
down all electrical systems, switch to emergency air (scuba
regulators/mouthpieces), and get to the surface
asap.
Thanks
Everybody,
Cliff
Hi Cliff,
About sitting on batteries in a sub... Have you
ever seen/heard one explode? It CAN happen while
discharging, especially if there is a poor or corroded
connection at the battery pole enough that when you pull a
fairly large current, a spark may occur. Last summer my
son got in my pickup and went to start it. I had been
driving it 15 min. earlier. When he hit the starter, the
battery exploded under the hood with a sound of a deer rifle
shot. Acid went all over the engine
compartment, the battery was split wide open, and luckily,
there were no dents in the hood.
Moral of the story... IF you have to have them in the
compartment with you... make sure you are shielded from an
explosion, BUT make sure there is still ventilation to allow
any explosive gas to dissipate. PS Of
course, my pickup didn't have
hydrocaps!
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