Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Spearfishing

[SIMON WALKDEN <mrsym0r@gmail.com>]

Hi Guys!

Let's hope all this doesn't turn into an all out flame war..

Firstly, I don't have a big problem with recreational fishing. I
personally don't enjoy it, but many/most people I know do it
regularly. If you look at a world map, you'll see New Zealand  is
small, thin, and surrounded by the ocean. No matter where you are in
New Zealand, you are never more than a few hours drive to the ocean.
We're a country of people who love to fish, dive, water ski, go
sailing, and in general get out on the water and have fun. The only
fishing license you need is for fresh water trout; aside from that,
anybody who has a fishing rod is more than welcome to try their luck.

I agree with you that commercial fishermen are the problem. I'd be
suprised if recreational fishing was to make up 10% of what is caught
each year. HOWEVER, commercial fishermen go out deep in order to get
their catch. Recreational fishermen generally hang around bays and 
close to land, in shallower water. I'll give an example : you have
hundreds of boaties going out each day, each with at least two people,
and for the purpose of being pessimistic, only catch one fish each.
Two hundred fish a day, which becomes 1400 fish a week. It's a small
amount in comparison to the amounts that commercial trawlers catch,
but for a relatively small area, your local bay and favourite fishing
spots quickly begin to empty out. Once the big fish are gone, there's
nothing to eat the sea urchins. Once the sea urchins have no
predators, they continue to multiply and wipe out most underwater
vegetation. With no underwater vegetation, the remaining smaller fish
go elsewhere. With no smaller fish, like algae eaters, the ocean turns
into the rather unpleasant shade of green which most people will
recognise at local, fairly populated beaches and marinas. No
visibility, no fish, just the odd jellyfish.

But this is going off topic.

Let's face it - spearfishing isn't really a challenge. Fish don't swim
away in fear, the same way a deer will run for it's life the second it
smells the slightest hint of a human. All you need to do is swim down,
wait 10 seconds or so, point the gun  and pull the trigger. The least
you can do is take your gear off, and give the fish something  of a
chance of getting away.

So what if you have to cut your line of a fish is pulling you under?
That's the point of not wearing your gear! Once you lose your scuba
gear, it becomes a challenge. IT BECOMES SPORTING.

Hunters already have enough challenge catching their prey - they must
stalk it silently, conceal themselves, and hope to god that the wind
doesn't change direction, alerting their prey to their presence.

I don't know what sharks are like in Florida, but here they're not
really an issue. They are in no short supply, but I have yet to hear
of anybody who has had a nasty experience with one.

On that note, have you tried spearfishing without your SCUBA gear? I
cannot speak from personal experience, but those I have spoken to
about  it say it's absolutely fantastic. You'd be suprised the efforts
the 'spearie' community goes to in order to maximse their
breath-holding time; so far as to enroll in yoga classes just for the
breathing exercises.

If you're ever in the southern hemisphere, I also recommend you drop
into New Zealand and try some diving here. Jacques Cousteau personally
placed one of our marine reserves in the top 10 dive sites in the
world. The most interesting aspect of the underwater life  here is the
transitions you see - the tip of New Zealand is close to the equator,
hence beautiful coral reefs. On the other end of the scale, in the
south, is the closest land to antarctica, hence some really amazing
stuff. There's a place in Fiordland where a river runs off nearby
mountains, taking on tannin from decaying leaves, making the water
brown and running onto a local bay. This has made the first 3metres of
it freshwater, and brown, yet below this layer is crystal clear salty
seawater.

Anyway, I'm rambling. The bottom line is that everybody will have
different opinions, and as a wise man once said, "I may not agree with
what you say, but I will fight to the death your right to say it."

-Simon



On Apr 1, 2005 9:41 AM, Akins <lakins1@tampabay.rr.com> wrote:
>  
>  
> My thoughts on the morality of spearfishing while using scuba. 
>   
> I live in Florida. Most of the divers I know spearfish at least some, but
> not always or on every dive. Myself and most of my dive friends just do it
> enough to keep our freezer full. 
> Have any of you seen the programs on t.v. that occasionally air that show
> those huge fishing freighters where the whole front end of the freighter
> opens 
> up so they can haul their giant fish catch aboard? This ship is big and not
> only pulls in tons of fish but also catches protected species which are
> injured and die on the 
> deck sometimes before they can be thrown back. Dolphins, sea turtles and
> other protected species are injured and killed all the time. But does the
> government put 
> a stop to this? NO! 
>   
> These type of large fishing vessels are actually a floating fish production
> factory. Not only do they catch quite literally many, many tons of fish
> along with protected species, but they actually 
> process the fish, package and box them up so they are ready for the shelf as
> soon as the ship docks. 
>   
> These type of vessels are what is most responsible for the depletion of fish
> and marine life, NOT the few fish taken by the spearfishing diver who gets a
> bad reputation because 
> "OH! you better do something Mr. government! He has a gun! He might hurt
> somebody with that thing!"  Guns have become so demonized in the hands of
> civilians today that even the spearfisherman falls prey to the 
> antigun hysteria. But will the government stop those large fishing vessels?
> Of course not! Why not? Because people like to eat fish in restaurants. 
>   
> When a person goes hunting in the woods today. They have a wide selection of
> repeating firearms to hunt with. Even the bowhunter can shoot faster and
> without distorted vison  (and without worrying about sharks) than the
> spearfisherman can. 
> The spearfisherman only has the equivalent of a bow and arrow to hunt fish
> with. Kind of like a ancient American Indian hunting a deer with his bow and
> arrow (except the Indian can reload faster), plus the spearfisherman is
> looking thru a 
> mask that somewhat distorts his view and makes the fish appear to be larger
> than it actually is which can throw off his aim. He has to deal with the
> equivalent of a Grizzly bear (sharks) coming along and trying to either take
> what he has 
> hunted or actually eat the spearhunter themself! There are no trees to climb
> to get away from those underwater grizzly bears nor can you run like you can
> in the woods. You have to hug the bottom and hope the shark goes away or try
> to make 
> it to the surface and hope he doesn't follow the bloodtrail of your fish
> catch. I hate sharks, there are a lot of bull sharks around here. I also
> have a healthy respect for them. 
>   
> Yet there are people who say this is not sporting enough! Some regions have
> passed laws that do not allow a spearfisherman to wear scuba. So now not
> only does he have all the above to deal with, but he has the added risk 
> of being dragged along underwater and drowned by a large grouper he just
> speared because "it isn't sporting to wear scuba!!" How many of you have
> ever speared a large fish and been dragged along underwater by it? You damn
> well 
> better be  good at holding your breath or else you will have to cut your
> line. Why don't we make bowhunters in the woods wear a plastic bag over
> their head when they hunt so they must hold their breath when they hunt?? 
> Sound ridiculious and silly? Of course it does. Get my point? 
>   
> Actually I feel the government hampers spearfishermen because they don't
> make as much on taxes on spearfishermen. Oh yes we pay for our fishing
> license but that is not enough for the government. They get more taxes from
> the 
> commercial fishermen for them to fish, they get taxes when the fish are
> sold, they get taxes when you buy the fish. They only get taxes ONCE from
> the spearfisherman from his fishing license. Also hassleing the spearhunter
> goes 
> along with the agenda of disarming the people and taking guns and any weapon
> away from them so they will have to rely on the government for protection
> and buy their food which makes the government taxes and regulates. 
>   
> When I am hampered by low visibility, a tank and bcd and other equipment on
> my back, watching out for sharks, looking thru a distorted view in my mask,
> and only having one shot before I have to retrieve my spear and reload......
>   
> I'll be damned if anyone can say that is not sporting!  Besides, who says it
> has to be sporting? Why does a spearfisherman have to be sporting? Why is it
> susposedly immoral to spearfish with scuba but it is not immoral for 
> the floating factories to catch them by the tons with nets? Why not make
> commerical fishermen only able to catch their fish with a hook and line or a
> spear? IT'S UNSPORTING TO CATCH THEM WITH NETS!  Now isn't that silly? 
> Would you like to pay the price it would cost you to buy your fish if they
> had to catch them that way? 
>   
> Was it sporting for you to eat your fish last night at your favorite
> restaurant that was caught by a floating factory???????    I really am sick
> of the hypocracy. I am also a member of the American N.R.A. (National Rifle
> Association) 
> I apologize if I sound cranky and disgusted about this but this hits on my
> last nerve and I am tired of the bullsh_t.    Of course this is just my
> opinion from experience. I think I am entitled to that. 
>   
> Nuff said. 
>   
> Kindest Regards, 
> Bill Akins. 
>   
>  
>  
>  
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: Brian Cox 
> To: Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org 
> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 1:04 PM 
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Spearfishing 
> 
>  
> Alec, Simon, Cliff, and All    ( changing thread name) 
>   
>   
>        My main interest in the spearfishing thing is that I would like to
> use my sub for a possible fishing purpose.  Actually farming fish would be a
> more responsible way to get fish.  People need to eat and using a sub for
> that purpose I think would be a good thing.   Afterall many types of fish
> are getting depleted from over fishing.  But there are those who are also
> against farming fish,  They point to diseases that are spread when fish
> farming operations are set up.  I guess those people (PETA) don't want you
> to utilize the ocean to feed the hungry in any respect . 
>   
> Brian



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