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Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Empress of Ireland (was: Forbes story)
Unfortunately, I have to agree with Carl. Our right
to build and use personal submersibles could be
endangered. I know they would go ballistic if you
were to try diving a sub in the snake river. That's
right, I said the snake river. We all really should
be considering how to retain our right to build and
dive subs. Besides, model rockets have been illegal
for a long time (that's what limits the size of those
silly Estes boosters), it's just that most people
don't
realize it. A sub is every bit as potentially lethal
to a civilian or military target as a small rocket.
Hopefully the personal submersibles movement is small
enough to keep out of the limelight.
Warren.
--- Coalbunny <coalbunny@vcn.com> wrote:
> Sadly Steve, you hit that baby right square on the
> head. Right now they
> are attacking model rocketry. Next? Hmmmm. ATVs?
> Off roading?
> Personal submarines? Ahhhh, the part we all dread!
> What people don't
> see is the "threat" a personal sub can *appear* to
> be to those that are
> untrained. They see a sub. They think "he's trying
> to hide something
> or hide himself while doing something wrong".
> Doesn't matter IF the
> intent is there, what counts is the interpretation
> of those that are
> ignorant and armed. Let's see you argue with a boat
> load of armed
> psycho park rangers.
> This really bothers me as I'm not near any oceans.
> I suppose I could go
> to Flaming Gorge (UT/WY), Lake Powell (UT/AZ),
> Seminoe Lake (WY), Lake
> Mead (AZ) or even Blue Mesa Reservior (CO). One
> problem- they may be
> big enough to satisfy my submairne interests, and
> they are deep enough
> as well, what keeps all that water back? A dam.
> What kind of dam?
> Nothing major. Just a HYDROELECTRIC dam. You know,
> a terrorist would
> love to hit a hydroelectric facility. Lake Powell
> produces a lot of
> juice for LA and Las Vegas. Same with Lake Mead. A
> lot of those are
> high output.
>
> Ok, so you have an ignorant armed ranger or cop
> sitting at the lake for
> lunch. He sees you pull up with a sub and start
> putting it in the
> water. TERRORIST!!!!!! So he pulls up and demands
> your paper work.
> You show it, but to no avail. Afterall, a terrorist
> would stop at
> nothing to destory something like that dam, right?
> Uhhh, yeah. Right.
> lol! I know and YOU know they won't, but this is a
> ranger that has
> difficulty putting two and two together without a
> building permit.
>
> Are all ranger and law enforcement authorities like
> that? No. I never
> said they are. Unfortunately I have met a few that
> are just like I
> described. I had a 1988 Nissan pickup painted
> camoflauge for hunting
> season. Got pulled over for close to a hour or two
> by a county
> sheriff's deputy. His first question, "So, are you
> one of those crazy
> militias?" And this was BEFORE 9/11.
>
> I realize that with the political crap that one
> fella was ranting about,
> you guys may not appreciate what I'm saying. But
> think about it. Now
> it's model rockets. Do you really want to wait
> until the next thing
> resricted is personal submarines? Honestly a psub,
> in theory, has all a
> terrorist could want. More so than model rocketry.
> How long do you
> think it's going to be until they start restricting
> psubs?
>
> I don't know if I'll ever get mine built. First
> things first, get the
> money and the plans. And between now and when I get
> all that, they can
> change the laws making it illegal. Oh well, all
> that time and money
> right down the toilet.
>
> Sorry for the rant, but it's true. You just gotta
> think about it, is
> all.
> Carl
>
>
> Steven Mills wrote:
> >
> > >From: Coalbunny <coalbunny@vcn.com>
> > >
> > > A few years back there was a buddy of mine that
> had some land in Eastern
> > > Utah. He found some raptor-like lizard buried
> there and the BLM told
> > > him he couldn't touch
> it.........snip...............
> > >
> > > Sorry, rambling again.
> > > Carl
> > >
> >
> > Indeed, Carl, don't get me started. Unfortunately
> this is not a singular
> > or isolated incident. There are other cases just
> as incidious.
> >
> > My concerns would be bureaucratic redtape and
> restrictions imposed
> > on personal submersibles. There's already talk
> about putting a clamp
> > on model rocketry because of security risks. I
> know....what does model
> > rocketry have to do with pSubs? Nothing and
> everything. Legal things
> > tend to have a cascading effect and once
> precedence is in place it can
> > have an effect in other areas.
> >
> > If anyone took the time to read some of the
> messages in the Slasdot
> > site:
> >
> > Ref : Thursday, February 20, 2003 4:11 AM "Check
> this out!"
> > > "Dale A. Raby" wrote:
> > >
> > > Well, gentlemen, we have been "Slashdotted"!
> > >
> > >
> http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/02/19/177211
> > >
> >
> > There were more than a few messages expressing
> concern about pSubs
> > being a risk to "homeland security'.
> >
> > I don't expect nor is it my intent to extend this
> topic beyond this message.
> > However, it might behoove some of us to keep
> vigilant watch on any
> > legislation that will preclude an honest pursuit
> among honest and sincere
> > individuals engaged in the science and engineering
> of submersibles
> > and exploration.
> >
> > There ! Enough said. I'll shut up now.
> >
> > --Steve
>
> --
> "You delight not in a city's seven or seventy
> wonders, but in an answer
> it gives to a question of yours, or the question it
> asks you, forcing
> you to answer, like Thebes through the mouth of the
> Sphinx." -- Kublai
> Khan
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